What’s the meaning of Embodiment?
;a tangible or visible form of an idea, quality, or feeling.
;the representation or expression of something in a tangible or visible form.
Is it time to up level your success? This episode was inspired by 2 different things.
One is around all the goal setting that happens at this time of year and how without going past the goal setting stage and stepping into embodiment, our goals may never be realised.
And secondly, what happens when we get to the stage of success that we thought was possible for us – how to we up level to that next stage?
Before we can become something new or experience a new level of success, we first must change our thinking and shift our belief patterns so we can create a new external experience.
Every day we are surrounded by the same experiences, same people, same environment and 80% of our thoughts are the same we had yesterday. So how do we create something new if all we are experiencing is the same?
We must first unlearn our old thoughts and beliefs and then embed new thought patterns through these stages of
The Love What You Do 2 Day Business Mastermind
Heart Centred Entrepreneurship can be hard sometimes but it all becomes so much easier when you surround yourself with other passionate, heart
This is why I created this 2 Day Mastermind. To allow all female leaders to tap into their potential and to find new and exciting ways to do business in 2019 in
February 16 & 17 are fast approaching and the early bird tickets to the 2 Day Business Mastermind are ending soon! If you are ready to say yes and want to secure your spot click this link below to find out more and secure your spot for the retreat!
Makenzie Marzluff is a conscious entrepreneur who is passionate about heart-centered leadership & creativity. She is the Founder of Delighted By Hummus and KAKAO Ceremonial Drinking Chocolate. Cacao enthusiast. Voice for Mother Earth & all of her blessings, from plant-medicines to essential oils to the trees and beyond. Speaker on the new paradigm of big (and small) business.
This beautiful heart centred conversation covered all this and more:
To find our more about Makenzie’s June Event check out this link –
To find out more about Kakao Ceremonial Drinking Chocolate
To follow the journey and connect with Makenzie head over to Instagram:
Over the Christmas break, I took some time to review and reflect on 2018 especially focusing on what worked and what didn’t work in my business. If you listened to last week’s episode with Kirsten you will have heard that last year was a massive year of growth and expansion, especially in my business. Throughout the reflection, I came to find 7 key strategies that I used to create the results and success for 2018. So today I want to share them with you in the hope that maybe you could implement them into
Let’s get started~!
*Prioritise your money makers and business drivers
*Creating an effective opt in for lead generation
*Lift your visibility
*Be seen as a leader in your field
*Make your offer – ask for what you want
*Clarify and Simplify your offering
Here is the Free Guide Download – Creating an Incredible 2019 – 7 Revenue Strategies to grow you business
And feel free to SIGN UP to the MASTERCLASS Happening Wednesday 9th January at 7pm (Brisbane Time) – You’ll also get access to the replay if you cannot make the live class.
To finish this incredible year off, I have invited my beautiful friend Kirsten Morrison to join me to reflect on the lessons, wins
Embracing the journey and the twists and turns
The key things that created our results
The commitments that you show up for making all the difference
Are you committed to your excuses or your results?
Developing trust in abundance
Aligning your money mindset
Trust and surrender and practicing non-attachment with the outcome
Listening to universal nudges
Pushing yourself outside your comfort zone
Confidence embedded in action
Leaning into growth with a purpose
Owning your achievements
Preparing for 2019
Kirsten Morrison is an Empowerment Alchemist – guiding women to embrace their inner wisdom, step into embodied truth and empowered living. It is her mission to guide one million hearts to return home; stripping back the layers to reveal
What’s your intentions for how you want to feel over the Christmas period?
Replace your expectations for appreciation
Connecting with compassion and understanding
Lead with love not for fear
Give from a place of true giving
If you are feeling disconnected or lonely – be the first to engage
Real-life couple and intimacy coaches Jodie Milton and Reece Stockhausen started Practical Intimacy with the mission to transform how people do relationships. Through their one-on-one coaching practice, couple’s mentoring programs, online courses, and blog, they help men and women all over the world to create deeply fulfilling intimacy, thriving long-term connection and a super hot sex life. Their fresh and relatable approach has seen them work with clients across Australia and abroad, and their articles featured on sites such as The Huffington Post, Mind Body Green, Living Now and Raw Attraction.
Today’s exciting episode delves into all of these topics and more:
Connect with Reece and Jodie on Facebook and Insta @practicalintimacy and check out their blog at www.practicalintimacy.com
And free access to their online training course- Conflict to Connection:
You can also check out the Video of our Interview here:
Unknown 0:03 Thank you so much for joining me today. Jody, erase it for practical intimacy. I’m so excited to jump into this conversation. hear all about your business, and everything that you’ve accomplished over the last four years. So welcome. Thank you. Hey, yeah, Unknown 0:21 sorry. This is a great conversation, talking all about relationships. And it’s so key, because I think relationships are such a huge part of our life experience. So can you tell us a little bit about how practical intimacy got started? Yeah, absolutely. For us, the story is really the story of our relationship and how our relationship started. So for us, that was just over six years ago, we just have three other day. Unknown 0:49 And basically, when we have rejected my relationship, we’ve been together for five years. And we just had the experience of losing ourselves and our relationships. I for me, I just had that feeling. I didn’t know who I was. And I really lost the things that lead me up that I was passionate about. And in my experience, at the time, it felt like my partner was controlling me on allowing me to do things, which wasn’t the case in knowing how to be in relationship. And so you can imagine how much strain that relationship we were fighting a lot, or the norm, how to resolve conflicts. And so adventure, that relationship fell apart. And for you, you’ve kind of been in a similar situation. Unknown 1:44 Yeah, I think coming out of that relationship, and just having the big realization of how much I lost myself in that relationship. And really, a lot of the healing work that came after that was around developing my relationship with myself, and how do I get back to being that person who I want to be in the world that I’ve given up unconsciously being in relationship. And so when God and I first got together, that was really one of the defining characteristics of how do I stay true to myself, like, how do I really prioritize my relationship with myself, and at the same time, be open to exploring relationship with another person. So it’s not an either or thing. But it’s important. And I think like a, like a lot of people who, who run like passion businesses, our business really grew out of this personal development work that we were doing as individuals, and as a whole in a relationship together. So we actually spend the next couple of years traveling around the world, just learning everything that we could about relationships, not with the intention to start a business, but just so we could optimize this relationship, so that we weren’t going back to having those old styles or relationships where we lost ourselves where we didn’t have sex for months, or years on end. And so it was really like for us, first and foremost. So, you know, taking courses, reading books, doing workshops, and just doing all the personal development work to really learn how to make relationships rock, at the end of that we kind of had the realization of, Hey, we were really nailing this relationship thing. And it just grew out of that, and the desire to, hey, maybe this is where I’m just something here, we should be sharing this with other people. And that’s really how Unknown 3:32 practical there’s a lot of what we found was like, why there’s actually science today, so much of what we thought about relationships, even accurate, but when you challenge me, it opens up so much possibility for really valuable, nourishing, rich relationships. And then there’s just a whole lot of stuff that we just wouldn’t have a tool at all. I mean, we don’t get much of a relationship, that relationship education is not really a subject in school, and kind of do a very small business education, but also not great. And so there’s just so much we don’t know. But once you learn to simple tools, number development of a framework, it’s actually much easier than you think. And so once you kind of once we knew that, it just tell everybody needs to know this Unknown 4:22 yet. So I would actually really love to know what’s the key things that you both individually had to work on yourselves through that journey of understanding all of that, what would you be able to share just one or two things that you worked on? Personally, Unknown 4:37 me, one of the big things was challenging me, Unknown 4:43 I just need to find the right kind of my head, I had always live tweet that just need to find the right person, which sounds okay, when you first look at it. But actually, it’s kind of just an adult version of, I just need to meet my fairy tale Prince. And then we’ll ride off into the sunset together, and everything will be fine. It’s Yes, you want to meet somebody who you’re compatible with, and have shared values. But it’s more than just, you made the right person and easy and that’s a life You don’t have to doing Hangouts. And that really came up for us when things got top when this relationship when we did have an argument, or when we went through a phase of not having sex, or when I started to feel smothered on last relationship again, I just would think, oh, he’s not the right person. For me, clearly, I haven’t. And I’m out of here. Like I used to me running away and just cutting cutting ties as soon as things pop top was a real patent that I had to come up against. And I had to face and basically had to make the choice. So is this relationship worth working on? Is this relationship worth going deep? And is this relationship worth what we call meaningful insurance, like, enduring the challenging times? Because there’s a bigger vision or being a meaning behind what this relationship gives me and sort that was a massive changing point for me, I really had to learn the fact that I did just run away when things go hard, or I would shut down or clothes off and really facing my arms very out makes them relationship. Yeah, Unknown 6:24 I think to like, what you were saying about insurance. Like, I think now divorces become so normal that it’s like, well, if it’s not working, then we divorce whereas if it’s like, when you think back if I think back to my parents, like they happily married, but I don’t even know how many years now. But like really long time and it’s going through those hard times. And those hard times that actually made them stronger when I look back at the challenges that they’ve been through, and that six kids for god sakes. And you know, that insurance i think is just it’s not like anything with the way that society goes with instant gratification. We want it all now and if it’s not great that we throw it out right so it’s like that constant the word like like the way that we use things to just started them out when they when they use like, yeah, Unknown 7:10 yeah, absolutely Unknown 7:13 dangerous. The meaningful part is really important because I know sometimes divorces a really good idea. And sometimes their relationships where the insurances meaning less, but that’s where you just putting up with sheet and that’s not necessarily a good idea, but the meaningful and you’re into something that I think we definitely as a culture have forgotten. And once you know how to have to enjoy meaningfully, then it does in many ways carrier when, as you say, make your relationship stronger. Amazing. So what would you say you also have a race, Unknown 7:47 a couple of things come to mind in response to this. The first was remain committed to my passions. Oh, yeah. As I realized that, in my past relationships, there was a tendency for me to put my own needs aside, and it wasn’t a conscious decision. But I would always make the relationship my priority. And my partner had never asked me to do that. But just for my own psychology, and the way that I’m wired, as a person that, you know, I would just yet put my own needs to the side and just give up myself to be in the relationship. So, yeah, meaningful insurance in a way, by learning how to bring myself back into that, to still recognize that relationships are priority for me, and, you know, they contribute to my well being in a huge way. And at the same time, how do I stay committed to my own vision, to my own passions, to the things that fill me up as an individual. So I’m not having that experience of losing myself in a relationship. Unknown 8:57 Oh, I think we’ve all been in a situation like that they were all had friends. And you can see them actually do that, where they just forget who they are. And it’s all about their partner, and you just think, hang on a minute, you get to have a choice to and you also get to choose what makes you happy with so many. So I see that happen a lot. So what would you say some of the common problems you find that couples have they’re experiencing when they come to you, Unknown 9:23 when we start, Unknown 9:25 I think communication shy, no fans are disposable five is a couple of key thing and communication that we face a lot that will speak later. I think a lot of the time we are fully communication, fives, we might be talking at each other along, we might be saying a lot of things, but we’re not really understanding each other. And we’re not really getting to the heart of the issue. And so the way that can play out, it’s quite offended, someone will turn to their partners, like, here’s this thing that’s going on for me, and upon will go straight into fixing and I’ll try and fix the problem. And then it’s like, You’re not listening to me, you know why my listening like I am listening, I’m afraid new solutions. Of course, I’m listening know that sense of like, just not getting a job not feeling like I’ve been having, I don’t feel met by my partner. And then that creates a lot of really hot or a king conflict that sense. And we’re not on the same page, we don’t get each other that frustrations. And so we we help couples deal with that. First and foremost, communication is really important. And that that really impacts every aspect of our relationship is, is knowing how to handle conflict, sir, wonderful couples come to say is they kind of ground down by conflict the ground down by miscommunication or feeling ground down, because they they don’t collect they’re on the same page. And that’s quite distressing to feel like you don’t assign pages or not. Unknown 10:53 Yeah, I think in terms of that, like, what brings people to us, like, what are the problems that people are experiencing is just this whole notion of intimacy. And, you know, when we talk about intimacy, most people assume that we’re speaking about sexual intimacy. And we use those words anonymously, intimacy, equal sex, and we take a much broader definition of intimacy, in terms of intimacy is just that the quality of connection in your relationship, which can be sexual, absolutely, which is a huge part of relationships, sexual intimacy, but just on that day to day, how men and how understood do you feel? How, how much do you feel like you get each other? How much do you feel like you’re on the same team, and then you’re working together towards a shared vision, that’s really the problem that brings people to us, and just this lack of intimacy, this lack of quality connection, and what we have this saying the most problems that couples are experiencing our problems of connection, Unknown 12:00 vacation, and, you know, God said, we can be talking at each other, we can be complaining about all these things that are going on with think we think we’re communicating, but at the heart of that is just a real lack of connecting with one another, and really having the tools to be able to get beyond the surface problem, the thing we think we’re arguing about, or the thing we think we’re trying to solve, and just get back to that place that the heart of it’s like, oh, we are on the same team, how do we make this about us versus the problem instead of my problem versus your problem. And we’re on opposite sides, we’ve drawn the battle lines, how do we come together and solve this problem together for being on the same team, instead of being against each other Unknown 12:47 federal conflict resolution? Unknown 12:50 Yeah, and sometimes people that’s just experienced as a yearning, I just have this more depth in a relationship, more intimacy will connection, three said, more quality time together. And that, that is just that, that yearning. And sometimes it’s also the yearning for more sex for more sexual connection. Or sometimes it’s a yearning for the conflict to stop. And often it’s just that feeling of like, this is the desert and all that it could be. And that’s what really brings clients to us. Amazing. So what is it that you love about what you do, what’s your, what’s your favorite part Unknown 13:30 we get, we get to have couples come to us. And they’re in this place like that they don’t feel on the same page, I think they feel like they’ve lost the love and we get to be with them, when they feel that love again, like when we see it, we see them look at each other. With that sense of understanding, we get to save them guard from funny to being in love. Again, we have just recently that was a client who said, We before it was like this point, like, we just don’t want case, we just don’t like each other anymore. They’ve been together maybe 15 years. Well, too often about a month working to us, you can hate brought tears to my eyes. He said, now that I feel that I have the respect of my woman, I would, Unknown 14:16 I would do anything. Unknown 14:20 And we knew that they felt that way before, but they couldn’t see it. Unknown 14:30 Because when we have a couple second front of us, we can see the love between them, we can see very clearly what has kept them together, and what continues to keep them together. And like most people, when we have problems, when we have just connection now lives, that’s all we’re focused on. So that’s always we’re feeding the problem. And yeah, to see them go from just being so focused on the problem, even while so much love and intimacy and connection is there but they don’t realize it to then it’s recognition is the word that’s coming up for me in this when they get to recognize and really see each other again, and the relaxation that happens in them, and the softening. And again, just the way that they look at each other. And the way they speak to each other like, Ah, yes, Unknown 15:24 we see now Unknown 15:26 I think probably, I think the whites probably transformation because we also do work one on one with clients and some of our clients on in relationships. We also work for single people. And it’s a similar thing that we’re helping them create transformation. And we get to walk side by side with them as they create transformation their life, whether that transformation is around feeling more confident in their jobs, whether that transformation is around healing for a racy breakup, whether that transformation is around just being more full power in their own life. And I think that’s just the greatest gift on that we get to do that with people is so beautiful thing. I work with women reflex with men. And it’s just we both feel that way. It’s such an honor, yeah, I lost that dynamic to be able to go and work with a couple with a couple like, I think that dynamic so well together. And I would love to love to dive back into what we were doing before. But I would love to know a little bit more about what you feel is the key things that gets people to that stage of conflicts where know to need to be right, and those constant conflicts that are happening in a relationship, what are some key things that you feel that a couple really needs to work on, to be able to move through that and work past it. Because I think one of the key things is, there’s such a stigma around counseling here in Australia, and getting help, whereas you guys do is so different to counseling. And it’s understanding that there’s so much more that goes into a conversation or conflict, it’s not just about that, like he was saying, it’s not just about that one argument that having right then and there, Unknown 17:04 I think we need to put this conversation in context in terms of, we grow up. And we get programmed by media, by culture, by our family, by our parents about how to do relationships. And this is never explicit, it’s implicit, but it’s just the context in which we just absorbed this stuff by osmosis. And most of it is really unhealthy. Like, let’s be straight up about that, even about parents had a really good relationship, often than not, they’re not modeling that the greatest tools and techniques and mindsets and habits and ways of doing relationship. So we get exposed to that growing up. And then we become adults. And we just kind of pushed out of the nest into the world. And it’s like, now go have healthy functioning relationships, and a healthy functioning sex life with receiving no education, or no help on how to do that. So that’s what we’re working with here. No tools, no techniques, just some unconscious stuff that we’ve picked up and most of us are just bumbling our way through it. And also with the expectation that we should just know how to do it. And this is what trips us up. And this is why it’s so difficult to reach out and ask for help. Because of that expectation of all you just supposed to know. And the shame and the guilt a lot of people feel when if I’m just supposed to know this. But when I look at the quality of my relationships, and I look at how things are going between us, and it’s not working, what’s wrong with me? What am I doing wrong? And as soon as we asked that question about ourselves, our mind finds all the reasons that we are doing something wrong, which is compounds the guilt shame, which makes it the hardest thing in the load to reach out and ask for help and support. Unknown 18:55 Yeah, it’s that sense that we’re reaching out because we’re broken, which is really not how we say it, we really see the couples that are reaching out to us doing so because I want to be awesome, you know, it’s not about unbroken, we need to fix it’s like, let’s, let’s get awesome tools. So we can be more awesome. Let’s work on ourselves the same way that you don’t go to a pay TV because you’re broken, you got to pay tape because you want to be stronger. And so we really do kind of like to flip the script on this around what it means to go and get relationship card chain. It’s not about being broken, it’s about being stronger. And it’s about finding ways to create the dream of your relationship that can also be fun part of what we do we practically intimate scene our brand is we want this to be fun. We wanted to be real, we want it to be practical and relatable, Unknown 19:44 different it’s more the women that are driving the Unknown 19:48 coming to the coaching sessions or is it a mix or Unknown 19:53 Yeah, it’s it’s kind of tricky. I think probably women more often the instigators and I think that’s really a reflection on the amount of shame and have, you know, an app called job, how we tell men not to have feelings, you know, to not any sort of to be really strong and never need help. And it’s that extra kind of haiping of that shame and guilt and sort of federally a conditioning that race was talking about. But I think really does prevent men from reaching out. And I think we would have probably if we have more of a culture of women going and doing workshops and go into groups together and women circles and we do have a culture of personal development for women a lot more than we do. And then particularly in Australia, I feel like it’s finding other countries. We have clients in the US and I feel like the men are a lot more easier to work with you. And here in Australia. I think we think we have a particularly impressive culture, then Unknown 20:45 it’s often the case we found that yes, the one will be the instigator. Because of all the reasons that God mentioned and show often drag the partner somewhat unwillingly into our coaching or into working with us. And it’s always interesting, because very quickly, he’s like, Oh, this is great. Like, Unknown 21:08 I’m learning. I’m learning skills, and I’m learning tools. And I’m learning mindsets that helped me get what I want. That helped me connect with my partner, and oh my god, now that I know how to listen to her, we’re having more sex. This is great. Like, you can show me more that. Yeah, it’s always a very funny progression, that way of like, we know how awesome the workers and how relatable and how approachable it is that there’s just that often that little hurdle barrier for guys didn’t know about this it’s a little between what are these guys on about like to talk about my feelings and stuff but once they experience the results like oh, I get to have I get to get an have what I want my god testing Unknown 21:53 is I feel like now they have a giant that develops these like little frame indices with his clients and open the men of the ones who like I actually want to continue working with race because I don’t think men get many outlets to see Unknown 22:08 having said all that we absolutely do get manual you’re kicking you know bring a partner kicking and screaming as well I could go both ways right like and I really do want to acknowledge those men that especially if they’re listening by any chance that that all the instigators in their relationship and that are really driving their own cars. We absolutely do have those men as well. And I many ways that I do feel that at the forefront because they are resisting this this culture in this. DuPont awesome Unknown 22:38 man. Yeah, yeah. But I would actually love to hear from you race. Because any advice that you’d be able to give women who really want to get their partner to working with a coach working with you guys, what would you say would be a good way to broach the subject or to guide them into looking at it as a possibility? Mm Unknown 22:58 hmm. Good question. Who is it? Unknown 23:03 Ok. So the intention to want to work on your relationship is a notable one, because it’s a very clear recognition that, hey, there’s problems in our relationship, hey, there is things that I would like to work on. Or even alternatively, to that, I feel like there’s more for us. So I just want to acknowledge that the intention is a beautiful, genuine, powerful one, Unknown 23:29 unfortunately, what tends to happen is that it’s spoken in a way where Unknown 23:37 good intentions aside, can come across as pressure expectation and badgering. And what I’ve noticed is that most men have very, very sensitive to perceived criticism. So even though the intention is genuine, hey, I want to work on our relationship, even stating it in that way most men are going to interpret that is you’re not doing it, right, there’s something wrong with you, you need to get help. Unknown 24:06 And so just understanding that men are incredibly sensitive about a seat criticism. And so if we can understand that it’s about how do we communicate in a way that’s empathic, compassionate understanding. And then it’s an invitation instead of an obligation or expectation. And so one of the ways that we can do that in there to give some really practical examples here is stating in terms of what your desire is. So for the women stating it in terms of, I would really love for us to be more connected, I feel a yearning to be more intimate, we have this saying about underneath every criticism is a yearning beneath the complaint, that desire beneath the complaint. So you’re wanting him to be more involved in the relationship, if you’re wanting to step in and help co create this, then speaking that in terms of your desire, I really want us to go deeper, I’d love to feel like I can connect with you more. And that makes an invitation instead of an obligation or an expectation, which is going to be received in a much cleaner way. And it’s not necessarily that he will be all of a sudden, yes, I’m totally on board with, it will still need to be a dialogue there. And it’s still a very gently, gently approach. But just yeah, being very clear that it’s an invitation instead of an expectation, Unknown 25:34 I think something else to add to that is also taking ownership of like, for the way to take ownership for this is something you want to do for you. And as opposed to saying, like, you need to want to do it too. I think it’s sometimes a we can fall into a trap. But I want to do this thing, I’m interested in exploring it. And it says, it doesn’t have to come from it. Because this is work. And it’s just this I want to grow. I’m using that PT analogy again, like, I want us to be even stronger. Because like, we’ve got wealth to conquer together. And would you be willing to support me on that journey, because he might not wants to go into coaching, or he might not want to work and its relationship he wants to support you. And it was important to you, and you can earn that quite often we shy away from already things that we want to feel shame, Doris, this is something that I want, and I would love your support. And again, Unknown 26:29 and if he if the answer is you still go to the thing is why often we do work, I work with them in a relationship. But that doesn’t mean you can’t do the work. And it’s just taking that responsibility for what you own and defined. So in that case, where they are working on their own themselves in creating that gross to themselves that it becomes any form of disconnect. Because I I do notice with even with someone like business coaching clients, like the ones that are in relationships, I’ve got to make sure that I check in with what’s happening with that as well. Because so much growth that we do throughout my program, that there’s got to be that checking. And otherwise, there comes a time where the pot and feels like you’re changing this is, you know, you’re different now, like what’s How do you gauge that? How do you support them through that, Unknown 27:20 because a lot of what we teach communication, and we’re really encouraging to be communicating Unknown 27:27 and accuse me off work on the relationship there is interaction that Unknown 27:35 and it’s not just about working on oneself, isolated from the relationship is about working on your 50% of the relationship. So that does have an impact on the relationship, that relationship changes. But it’s not about going off and doing it like, you know, the amount into that. And I think it’s still very much leaving the relationship on the case that communication, so he feels like, he’s also still involved in that process as well. Unknown 28:04 There’s also a common misconception that when one person is doing the work, and this is especially prevalent with women who are doing low that person’s work, that he needs to be doing it like on his individual journey, he needs to be going to the workshops, he needs to be doing the things and there’s this is an unspoken expectation and assumption that that’s what it looks like to be met or on the same level. And I think a big part of what we do is like calling that out in that, yeah, there’s just this huge expectation about what he’s supposed to look like. And it’s, it’s often this way of the person who is doing the work of really kind of, I don’t know, avoiding themselves in a way, it’s like, it’s only a co creative relationship. And he’s doing the workshops as well. And so what we do is just like, again, it’s like, get that hundred percent responsibility for 50% of the problem. But this also ties back into that prioritizing your own self development journey, Unknown 29:07 and being comfortable with difference in your relationship. And so that it’s okay if he’s not doing the work the way that you’re doing the work. Because as we’ve been speaking about just one person focusing 100% on their 50%, the problem is going to change the relationship dynamic a lot. And some ways it’s going to make the other person uncomfortable. But in a lot of ways, it’s going to make the relationship work a lot better, because it only takes one person to completely transform relationship. So we really calling out that assumption that it’s supposed to look a certain way for him to be meeting you are stepping up Unknown 29:48 now, he is giving example, I’m working with her. And he’s not going on the journey, Unknown 29:55 he’s going on a journey, because the relationship is changing. It’s just that he’s not getting the same type of support you might be getting, or elsewhere, you might be getting, oh, by going surfing, you might get a support by doing his Stephanie’s work. You know, a lot of the time we find that man, it’s like their personal development is in Korea. And as I’m sure you know, and all of the people that you work with, like working on your business and your career will part of you. That’s a type of personal development doesn’t have to look like a Tantra workshop. And so yeah, recognizing that we each have our own way of doing that growth. And it is respecting and saying that it will vary on this as well. Because it’s often can also to come from a place of wanting to change someone. And it’s like, well, yeah, this is no need to change someone and being able to recognize that you’ve got to do the work yourself. But also notice that change, trying to change someone is like literally wasting your time. Unknown 30:57 Yeah, absolutely. So what would you say are some of the big myths that come into some of your coaching though, people come to you with you, just like God, just squash this? Unknown 31:07 I think the one that you again, which in terms of the one Unknown 31:11 yeah, Unknown 31:12 and you’re just shows up in so many different ways. And it’s especially prevalent in the environment. Yeah, like the one or the twin flame is the other way that is spoken about this assumption that if I just made the perfect person, then it will just flow and I won’t have to work on it. It’ll all be bright. And from an experience, it’s completely complete bullshit. Yeah, because like, no matter how well matched you may be, or how well aligned in terms of your values, or your last part, or how you live your life, there is always going to be conflict. Unknown 31:45 And so I guess that’s one of the other myths as well, that if we can get to a certain level of relationship, then there’ll be no more complex, Unknown 31:55 you know, just like your career, your relationships continually evolving. And as long as you’re alive, it’s going to continue bringing up your ship Unknown 32:05 very few great arenas for personal development in your relationship. And it’s about how do I see it as a practice? Unknown 32:14 How do I approach my relationship in a way in full knowledge that it’s going to continue to bring up all of my stuff, it’s going to continue to show me the places where I’m not honoring myself, where I’m not honoring another and how do I just make the commitment to showing up and facing that when it comes Unknown 32:32 up? And then it’s not a destination, right? Unknown 32:37 Yeah, yeah, Unknown 32:38 yeah. So I would love to know more about your experience with the fact that you guys work together at the same time as being in a relationship Unknown 32:47 legend that that would bring up even more stuff to tell us a little bit about Unknown 32:51 your journey by Unknown 32:52 how you how you do that, Unknown 32:55 I think is very well the question you just asked about, man. So the idea that differences of bad you know, that that opposites attract, so that we were supposed to be the same noise, Unknown 33:10 we are attracted to two assignments, we will always have those areas, and that’s something to be celebrated. But working together Unknown 33:20 really can be challenging. We do we are very different in many ways. The same is by far different than what’s become so much so I wanted to one of the key things to me like, Unknown 33:36 I like to kind of run like, I’m very like, speed of implementation. And let’s do this thing. Like let’s set a really quick deadline. You know, I’m always really looking forward and let’s do the next thing and dream big and Good, good, good, good try. Which is, you know, on the flip side or something I have struggled with my whole life recently other hand tense, like really think deeply about quality and consideration and like slowly slowly let’s take our time and you can imagine when we’re having business brainstorming meeting how that can be I can be really frustrated I’m like oh my god why is taking making decision already let’s go like impression to us. Yeah, sorry, something we really had some learning how to use that differences as a string Unknown 34:27 actually want to collaborate and respect the fact that we do printed to say, like, I now respect the races, that slowing me down. And that’s a good thing. I don’t need to be a million miles ahead, galloping as fast as I can, like, pulling on the rain that actually I’ve seen it time and time again, we will create better quality work, people feel better Unknown 34:53 if I allowed to, Unknown 34:58 and then vice versa. Yeah, Unknown 35:00 for me Unknown 35:04 the uncomfortableness and leaning into my Unknown 35:08 social me noticing that my default when my habit is to be very slowly. Let’s consider this. And let’s think of all the ramifications and all the possibilities. What does that mean an end of the same time, like, let’s have this view good as well. And so the growth engine for me is your understanding that I’m a comfort and security seeker in that way. And it feels really uncomfortable for me, like, Let’s go, gallop, and let’s do this exciting thing is like whoa. overstimulating and there’s also a lot for me to learn in as well. Because I don’t want to just indulge the things that I’m comfortable with a very much realized that if there is more for me to learn. So being able to push a little bit in lane a little bit even go a little faster than maybe uncomfortable, where it’s like, oh, wow. Yeah, we we can just do that thing in a day instead of a bar. Haha. Fantastic. That’s great. Yeah, we call that Unknown 36:06 collaboration. And we really recognize it as a complimentary Actually, Unknown 36:14 it’s also the ability to want to find common ground instead of again, like digging into our side this is the way I do things and best way you do things and here we have this saying, fuck compromise. Let’s collaborate because compromise brings up images of I have to we both have to lose something in order to just get along Unknown 36:38 that’s a crap model. I don’t want to have to keep up something just so it can be agreeable. Let’s take the time to really find a way that feels good and sometimes a little scary and exciting but the we’re honoring our strengths and we’re leaning into our uncomfortable growth engines and everyone’s a powder and yeah it’s a real creation collaboration any one of the key Unknown 37:04 things to me that has allowed me to do that one of my blogs that I’ve had to hurry if they’re always saying like Unknown 37:12 addition to being right and yeah I mean I mentioned that before it’s really an identity we we tie our part one so much to their opinions we think the challenging our identity right here that feels like I’m sorry suddenly Unknown 37:28 for me recognizing wow maybe my way is the right way maybe braces ways Maybe there is no right way let’s just entertain either were all right. And that has helped me to collaborate. Unknown 37:44 Whereas before like I have to compromise because my ideas, right, I have to let it Unknown 37:49 sit there and challenge perfectly often we might be like, a good 20 minutes into an argument for like, Unknown 37:56 actually the right way, maybe not completely wrong, and just challenging myself like that compromise, let go Unknown 38:06 freely. And with joy and happiness, I can actually see you’re right, that is best way forward here. Let’s do that. Then. I feel like that collaboration is going to just huge learning for us. There is one Unknown 38:21 yeah, absolutely love that. Because I guess easily translated to any form of relationship. But going back to just the normal relationship and having that beautiful collaboration and allowing your passions to come into it. And that you both you know, allowing that to happen and respecting other people’s strengths, other people’s passions that also to in a working relationship, whether you’re in a relationship with the person or it’s just your boss, or it’s just another teammate and respecting their strengths and their timing and their patterns and having that awareness and awareness is massive also Unknown 38:53 the same tools in any relationship Unknown 38:59 take the time to really get Unknown 39:07 priority when you’re in connections like this boys away to work together Unknown 39:12 and how does it benefit of I respect you Unknown 39:18 because I see I see the way for you to print I get to know I learned from him and as opposed to feeling like wow, this is whole universe going on in that and this man is capable as opposed to thinking I right he’s wrong when I when I flip the script it’s like actually he’s really capable and I love seeing my part of the capable that’s really sexy and so it can actually help us to come back to connection and deep respect and admiration Unknown 39:48 so so Unknown 39:49 important, like honestly, cultivating any form of relationship I think that that is that’s Kate and then the other person actually feels heard like you were saying earlier like that corn age actually feel like we’re being understood it entered that allows that to happen. Like if possible always filtered in vironment lovely so what would you say I’d love to hear it has been any major haiti’s value but any major challenge you’ve had with the new business that has been growing Unknown 40:19 the first couple of years that we were in business, we came into this we can no real prior business experience at all. So we’ve been traveling around the world. And we were actually in Turkey when we decided, Hey, I think we have the beginnings of a business here. And okay, well, what do we do? We need to find someone who can teach us how to run a business, which is exactly what we did. We found a great apartment in Turkey to live six months, we found ourselves a business coach who taught us how to run an online business. And the first couple of years were probably the hottest few years of my life. I have, I have been through a lot in my life. Like I struggled with depression and anxiety for a lot of my life. Yeah, I had a lot of challenges in my life. And by far, learning how to run a business on the other side of the world with no other support, besides my coach, and my partner was, yeah, not knowing how I was going to make ends meet, not knowing how we’re going to put food on the table. The next month, we had quit our jobs, we were traveling on savings, which were quickly dwindling, especially on the hiring a very high price business coach, and it was just the pressure to survive. Unknown 41:37 Yeah, like to that. Unknown 41:39 And then being in that with your relationship with that as well. Like, holy hell Unknown 41:46 yeah, we didn’t really put ourselves in the file maker. Right. Yeah, I mean, I Unknown 41:51 think one of the things, Unknown 41:56 we see our attention, Unknown 41:59 I think, for us, Unknown 42:05 and I think it’s so easy to fall into that based on the way that we see all the corrections, all the marketing, or around like, you know, these success stories and how people didn’t pray moms. But what you don’t know is that they were already working in industry, and I had all of these contacts, or they’re just a complete fucking here. Yeah, and those expectations will make that growth period, so much harder than it needs to be. Because on top of how we’re going to make ends meet, and wow, the learning curve is like this particular, you know, we’re not going on on top of that report, and we’re filing this it should look different, we should be somewhere other than where we are. And I think that just suffered a loss for, for quite a few, you really do make that for, as opposed to just enjoying, and be okay, with where we’re at, like, we were making ends meet, we were able to support ourselves, we didn’t borrow any money to build our business or, you know, in many ways we were, we were 16 now, we were profitable, very, very quickly and sore. But we couldn’t say that at the time. Because we have these expectations. And I were in many ways, something that joy out the whole process. It sounds Unknown 43:22 very cliche, but we weren’t enjoying the journey. Yeah, yeah, there was this, this goal out in the future, and this huge expectation pressure to get there to make it when I get there, then I’ll get to feel good. Once we have X amount of money in the bank, or once we have X amount of clients, then I’ll get to feel good. I think that’s been one of the biggest lessons over the past couple of years, is that again, as cliche as it sounds like you have to be here, and Unknown 43:54 to be during the journey to be acting from a place of I’m doing this because I feel it feels good to do this. Instead of I’m trying to get somewhere and then I get I’ll be happy when and I Unknown 44:10 were to say, this is what changed it because the truth is growing up for your business. Now. It’s also just we’ve been building a client base consistently, reputation momentum. But also we’ve seen a huge shift Unknown 44:23 because simply because, but we started to prioritize what do we want our business to feel like one of the passion projects, I’ve always wanted to write a book Unknown 44:34 coming out in April next year, we’ve always wanted to do couples workshops. So this year, we just started running couples workshops, we’ve always wanted to do a retreat. So in February next year, we’re running every tree. And when you know it, a business has doubled in terms of revenue tripled in profit. And I won’t say it simply because we just started doing what we love the artist. But I think there is a lot to be said for, we stopped worrying about what we should be doing and what was going to like, we were told we had to have an online course to remain not like force. And we we struggled through it, and it didn’t take off like be hard to work where the things that we felt really good about it really passionate about have been really successful. So I think that has been a really big learning for us is finding what is good for us, what really connecting to our why of why we started the business and allowing us to shape our business decisions, that that’s key, like when you have that positive energy behind it, then then a challenge that comes up, you could so easily overcome it. And it doesn’t feel like you’re just pushing uphill, it’s actually that this is exciting, this is happening and so fun. Whereas I think and even the from a business perspective, that strategies of just trying new things and implementing into new offerings, I think is massive, worse, people often get stuck in that place of nothing’s working. And then they do anything from that place. Where is it? Let’s just see what else we could try Unknown 46:03 to go. So you know, there’s a lot of noise in terms of business, this is the way Unknown 46:13 social media Unknown 46:16 as a new business, it’s because Unknown 46:23 all these people seem to have the answers like, Unknown 46:28 Okay, I’ve got to run a five day challenge, I’m going to do this. And it just becomes so overwhelming. And yet the sort of self defeating feelings that come up as like, I have to be doing all of these things. And absolutely, there was a time and place for all of those things. But I think it just takes experience and time to really understand that those are the things that works for those people. Unknown 46:55 And what works for me, maybe different, and just focusing on what actually feels good. Again, just coming back to that I want my business to feel good, I want to enjoy working on my business. And so if it feels good to try and create a funnel and cool go do that produce good to post on social media, cool, go do that. But just learning to really honor your own inner voice, and where you’re being compelled to go Unknown 47:22 and go get support with that, like, we run a little workshops, etc. So we went and got support coaching around how to successfully run workshops. But we didn’t do that. Because somebody else convinced us that we had to be doing workshops, that was a genuine interest for us to something that we really felt sorry, I think, and that’s where it says it just, it does take time and experience to work that out. Unknown 47:45 And I just like when I think about really enjoying the work, like, I just love that you guys are a niche. And you’re challenging yourself a new, growing new building that awareness around your own relationship, as well as the business relationship and the support you give your clients. But then also to like, I love it, how when you think about building a relationship and having the foundations in place, you then go and throw in the fact that you don’t actually have a stable place where you live. Unknown 48:12 I Unknown 48:14 like putting in final questions. And then, you know, running a business together. And then you have said, yeah, we have to remove who wants to a month because that might be like last week, twice. Unknown 48:28 Yeah, we were twice. Yeah, we live out of a suitcase, Unknown 48:35 we put ourselves in the deep end. Unknown 48:38 Yeah, it’s the nothing stable. We, we, Unknown 48:45 when we came back to Australia, Unknown 48:49 we weren’t ready to settle down in one place. And we’re still not like, next year, I’m going to Mexico because we want to be Mexico. And we can because the house sitting allowed us to do that. And again, it wouldn’t work for other people. But we had to find what works for us. And it comes with a cost Absolutely. Reading twice in one week is very challenging the business when you’re also running workshops and running and all these kinds of things. But it’s what the our lifestyle and so we got clear on that vision and and what we want for ourselves. Yeah, you know, it’s not easy, but anything worthwhile. It’s not easy. certainly interesting. Yeah, Unknown 49:31 we have their relationship is Johnny Our relationship is outlined Unknown 49:36 have a house, we don’t have a physical harm our relationship now we call it a relationship sanctuary, or our relationship cream, you know, it’s this place that we can come home to. And so we feel solid, even once a month wholesale, I just think it’s awesome. Unknown 49:55 Throwing all of that together. And it’s really pushing yourself to actually Unknown 50:00 walk right, like, so really important. I think you see so many people doing the online thing and make, you know, I love the fact also to that you’re challenging the norm of what it is, has to be all relationships have to be throw that throw it Unknown 50:15 all in and just say what Unknown 50:19 I feel really good about us as well. One of the cool part is just one on one clients and the couples is you get to decide, like, Unknown 50:31 you get to decide and design every aspect of your life. And we’ve existed in a culture that has tried to limit us What does effectively limit us in so many ways programmed to believe what we are capable of, and we help people bust through that because we continually push ourselves to bust through that programming to like, we get to decide exactly what this looks like. And that’s exciting and scary as fuck at the same time. It’s like, wow, the sky’s the limit. Or Unknown 51:03 do you have to work for it? And network doesn’t have to be struggle? You know, I think for us again, that really sad realization of, yeah, it’s taken us some four years to get our business to a point where we really feel it’s thriving, and that’s okay. So yeah, we get to define it. And it’s okay, that that takes work. Unknown 51:25 Not doing it wrong. If it doesn’t just instantly manifest for you. on your on your doorstep. Yeah, and all the good things take out that way. Absolutely. Play the long game. So Unknown 51:39 I’d love to know what are you excited about for 2019 Unknown 51:43 he catching Unknown 51:46 on to bring again, we get married in Thailand? Wow. Yeah, twice. Unknown 51:56 We are having a Unknown 51:57 ceremony in Thailand. But it won’t be legal. So we’re getting legally married in Hawaii, just this Unknown 52:04 card, then our book is being released. So we haven’t we haven’t released the titles that are interested in hearing about it. They can follow us on social media or join our email list, then, yeah, we’re next the card. We’re also running retreated. Even before we get married. I’m married couples retreat VIP. We can Unknown 52:30 again, find the email list or follow us on social media to hear about those details Unknown 52:36 this week, actually. So just some things will Unknown 52:41 be vision board for a while. We’re waiting for you Unknown 52:47 to get married. Yay. Unknown 52:55 And it’s not feeling like I’ll be reading it feels scary. You don’t want to wait too long. Because it’s like, it doesn’t feel don’t feel scary anymore. You waited too long, and you kind of lost the passion for it. So this is really cool picture. Unknown 53:30 And even though it’s been chaotic, with the house singing it’s still with established a part of how we live. And that’s about to completely change next year. So there’s also Unknown 53:43 I don’t know what’s gonna happen after that. Unknown 53:47 Yeah, I must admit way of sort of addicted to them Unknown 53:53 also. So you’ve just so generously given us an opportunity to get access to one of your courses. So you tell us a little bit about your conflict to connection course. Unknown 54:04 Yeah, Unknown 54:05 this is one of the core components that we teach a couple. So we have a an online group mentoring program called Rockstar relationship to six month free mentoring program. And at the heart of that is this conflict to connection framework. So as we’ve been speaking about Nicole today, this is really a step by step process of how you get to the heart of issues, how you go from the bickering, he said, she said, I’m right, you’re wrong. How do we get underneath that? And how we come to connection? And how do we collaborate from not place to solve the problem, quote, unquote, problem together, as opposed to trying to battle lines fighting. So yeah, this is really at the heart of a big part of the heart of what we teach couples. And everyone needs to know this, because like, once you nail this in your intimate relationship, and in every relationship in your life, everything changes Unknown 55:01 here and understanding get each other. Unknown 55:06 Awesome. Awesome. Thank you. So I Unknown 55:09 need to jump into that exciting also. Sorry, if people want to get in touch with you. How do they connect with you Unknown 55:16 on the social turn, Facebook and Instagram as practical intimacy. Also, people can, you know, try website practical intimacy, don’t we have blogs we have videos or that they could also get in touch with dots by sending us an email if people wanted to chat or even Pam privately for that kind of one on one support. So feel free to email us Hello at practical intimacy.com. Amazing, amazing. Thank you so much. Because I really appreciate all the beautiful, amazing knowledge that you’ve given us today, or insight and the polarity or creating a relationship while you’re moving around. Well, Unknown 55:58 thank you so much for having Unknown 56:02 me my absolute pleasure. So I cannot wait to share all of this. All of my listeners and no one best of luck for your wedding next year. And also to flex very excited Unknown 56:15 awesome
How often do we hold ourselves back for fear of being seen?
What are we afraid of? Being vulnerable? Being judged? How can we find the courage to put ourselves out there and release the fear of judgement and perfectionism?
How to create Omnipresence in your business.
Omnipresence is the art or illusion of being seen everywhere.
This is a key strategy designed to create like and trust with your audience and to grow your business.
The books I mentioned:
The subtle art of not giving a fuck – Mark Manson
The Life-changing magic of not giving a fuck – Sarah Knight
LWYD (Love What You Do) 2 Day Business Mastermind – Feb 16 & 17th 2019
Take 2 days out to create your 2019 Vision with inspiring women who want to up-level their mindset, motivation and business strategy to make 2019 incredible!
Connect with like-minded women as you learn from some amazing powerhouse women on how to take your business to the next level through workshops, experiences, connections, and collaborations.
For more info- Click the link – LWYD (Love What You Do) 2 Day Business Mastermind – Feb 16 & 17th 2019
Today’s episode is a delicious conversation with Anita Siek, Director of Wordfetti Group.
Born from her love of the medium of words and its ability to trigger different emotions to a reader, what began as a side-gig while juggling her Corporate role, then turned into her full-time gig. What began as 0 clients. Crickets. Nothing. Has today rapidly turned into a waitlist of like-minded clients who as part of their community understands the importance of language when it comes to communicating the value for their brand.
Wordfetti‘s client base ranges from local SME’s to corporate organisations, Aussie brands such as Lack of Color, to global brands such as Korea’s largest fried chicken brand.
For more information on Wordfetti and what they offer – feel free to connect here:
Our conversation covered topics such as;
LWYD (Love What You Do) 2 Day Business Mastermind – Feb 16 & 17th 2019
Take 2 days out to create your 2019 Vision with inspiring women who want to up-level their mindset, motivation and business strategy to make 2019 incredible!
Connect with like-minded women as you learn from some amazing powerhouse women on how to take your business to the next level through workshops, experiences, connections and collaborations.
For more info- Click the link – LWYD (Love What You Do) 2 Day Business Mastermind – Feb 16 & 17th 2019
Christine I’m excited to welcome the beautiful and data Anita from Wordfetti today. Thanks so much for joining me.
Anita 0:05 Thank you so much for having me. I’m very excited.
Christine 0:08 Tell us a little bit just to get started. Tell us what wordfetti is all about.
Anita 0:13 Oh okay. So we’re funny we’re a copywriting, SEO and we specialize a little pitch is that we specialize in helping brands stand out through strategies, psychology and words. So we don’t necessarily write copy based off of grief. We instead you know we write copy based off firstly understanding consumer behavior, the psychology of why people buy from a certain brand or engage a certain range and then we craft a message that is tailored to that. So that’s, you know, website copy. I think a lot of the time people are like copywriting for one. So here it is, here’s the little bit of a list; website, copy, video scripts, to pitch decks, marketing collateral to potentially a tagline you see on a billboard. Yeah, it’s got words on it was awesome.
I love that. And I think what really drew me to you, when I first met you was the concept of storytelling. Tell me why storytelling is really important to you.
The thing is, I think storytelling is important, I think because each and every single one of us and I say us as well. And this is also reflective of brands as well. I think each brand or each person behind all has a unique story to tell. And I think that sounds a little cliche, but it’s, it’s true. Like, there’s always there’s a secret sauce that makes at business or branch different to the others like you can have, you know, a question I usually ask like, what workshop participants is like, if you have to other major cupcake shop, and you have to car tech shops or the opposite sides of the street. Like what would make someone come to your store compared to your competitors down the road. I mean, for me, like imagine, yeah, the same cupcake shop. So we’ve got a cupcake shop that has got amazing delicious cupcakes versus a cupcake shop there has got the amazing delicious cupcakes. But it’s got that story about how this is a recipe that’s passed down, I don’t know for from grandma to daughter, daughter to now the owner of the account pixel like I don’t know about you, but I would probably go towards the one that’s got the secret recipe that’s been passed down through generations. And it’s it’s that storytelling that element and it may not necessarily be the recipe it may be potentially how you wrap the cupcake or it might be the sprinkles that you put on top it there’s always like one element or one secret sauce that makes a branch different from the others who have storytelling
I totally agree and it’s it’s so important to be able to differentiate yourself in this place where in the market where it’s sort of flooded with every type of business there is there’s got to be something different than makes you stand out absolutely I agree
100% I think there’s always so many people who like one of the questions I usually asked the funds is now what makes your brain unique and it’s at the beginning that was like oh it’s you know we just have personalized service that we deliver to our clients and in my mind I’m just like all that is great but that is the standard is not like I definitely agree that that is important and that is you know something that at the beginning of you know the copywriting journey they go on with us is something they saw as you need but it’s something that a lot of I see I guess I see a lot of brands horn ensure you know personalized service see quality products the you know all of that you know fighting towards I guess yeah when we standards like when you go into a shop to buy a product with the exception of the reject shock you I said but products to be on good quality yeah it’s it needs to be more than that
and I love how you put that because it literally is the expectation so things develop in the way that they can businesses evolve and certain things in the way that when there’s lots assign what’s the word like when it is become the norm to have that specific thing in your business that I can’t be your your unique positioning at all anymore. My business is always going to be evolving and it to the next you know two three stores down the road or actually having the same thing or you know the other business online whoever it yeah I have the same thing they join the same thing then you’ve got to still go past that and I think storytelling is 100% 100%
because that’s when when you tell me that unique story or whatever it is and I’m going to like a great example is I’m going to use I’m going to use this example my like is a lot of people know the brand but yeah Airbnb is one mainly because they’ve now their unique selling proposition or they need their story that story so a lot of other you know home share companies or holiday rental companies will focus on you know the convenience of the price service which is all true I probably cheaper to book an Airbnb but they don’t focus on that they focus on a completely different element which is if you want to travel like a local then book with us and that is such a strong story that even if someone else was to come around now and use that they’ll be like that is that is being base
Yeah. Um, I’ve had like over like, she’s actually could then interviewed the guys who, who created Airbnb and the way that their story was what, how it started out when they were actually just allowing people to sleep on that’s an LA LA beds and couches and stuff. So they can go Yes, also in the same area. Like it was just so so cool. But in the way that even further they were like, Okay, cool. So this is a unique positioning, what else can make us unique, the live event going to you and a baby experiences which makes the experience of that look like so much even more impactful. So I just love that I agree.
Unknown 6:18 Yeah, hundred percent. And there’s no better feeling than chicken engine in the Airbnb. I recently went to one recently in bar and they would knock on my door. I’m trying to take gene with some cookies and milk.
Unknown 6:33 Yes. Beautiful. So what other things do you normally ask your clients when you first get to get to know someone who can maybe start selling out with a new client? What are some key things you asked us to uncover a unique positioning or their storytelling voice?
Oh, my gosh, that is a great question. And that is very hard to answer. Because I it probably it’s a lot of questions a lot of a lot and a lot and a lot of questions. And it’s there’s no single list of questions that we do go through. It’s really just asking questions. And if there’s something that they say in the answer that we want to uncover a bit more we asked a question related to that again. But the whole purpose of I guess the first stage, I guess, is discovery and understanding in an earthing, you know, what makes this brand unique, but the whole purpose of it is really to, the best way I can put it is to put our brains literally into the head so that we can literally think, as an extension of their brain. So any question that will help us understand their business as though we are literally them, we will probably ask until we’re crystal clear that we are actually thinking about their business as though we are them like everything from, you know, where, like, where they see their brand darling is definitely one of them. Like, for example, what I mean by that is, if there are brands that really wants to be seen as the boutique or bespoke, you know, business that is only, I don’t know, five staff members from compared to say, like, yeah, like a graphic design agency, if they just want to be seen as the boutique, you know, five people x exceptional work as opposed to a full blown agency that is like, I don’t know, 5060 people, how you communicate to those two audiences are completely different. So it’s things like that is important, you know, watch whether or not they’re introducing, you know, products, whether or not there’s a, you know, they might be starting off with this, but, you know, the big goal is this, like, we need to know exactly what’s going on in the founder or the executive or there Yeah, that’s a person’s brain so we can actually see everything, see the landscape and then really dissect so that we can get that secret sauce out whatever that is. Um, yeah, I’m not a question so I didn’t really answer your question but yet another lot of questions.
So what is it that you love about the most what is absolutely part of that is to love the most but you
should be honest, I am going to say it’s actually not really going to be ironic but it’s not really just about the words to me it’s it has to be a covered a little bit just fine, but it what has to beach and just meet people and to meet people understand them hear their stories and Unknown 9:33 kind of uncovering kind of jumbling everything together. And mixing everything together and then finding that I guess unique selling points or that brand story to tell meeting people is would have to be and hearing their stories would have to be one of my favorite parts of the job. It’s one it’s an honor true it’s just particularly business owners themselves, like we were we both business owners and executives. But when you work with small business owners or you know SMEs like there’s just such passion and just such you know, gracious and perseverance like hearing their stories is Yeah, like that energy is contagious it’s just awesome how people it you know, it’s never a linear path to you know, doing what they do and sometimes you hear from I know doctors who have then gone on to become you know, a cupcake owner cupcake shop owner left it’s it’s it’s cool it’s awesome.
That’s awesome. And I think like even talking about stories in general hearing that you didn’t necessarily start out as a copywriter, you have a little bit of a story of your background and how wordfetti got started. Can you share with us that?
Yeah, yeah. Okay, so that’s correct. So mine was simpler nonlinear. So I let me pick where should I start. So I deeper traditional thing where you went to university and chose a few chats, you know, choice that you think would work so I my choices for law and psychology and I was six and a half years very, very six, I have used for two very expensive pieces of paper. And as if that wasn’t enough, I decided to get another piece of paper to say, I do not regret doing all of that. I mean, if I had the chance to do it, I may have just stuck with potentially just one sort of, Unknown 11:41 but I definitely do. I do not regret going through university. But that then led me to getting a corporate job. I worked in law firms I also worked in my most recent job was in the public sector. And I actually really enjoyed working in the different roles. I was in the Queensland Government. I really, really enjoyed it was rewarding. It was challenging, but I think deep within my brain I knew I just, you know, that moment when you’re just like, Okay, if I get this job, I’m going to be really happy. But then you get that job. You’re just like, Okay, cool. Still not happy? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it was exactly what’s happening. I just felt like that would be a role that I would want and then I would go and do everything I could to, you know, work towards that. And then I’d get it and then I’ll just be like, oh, okay, well, what makes it’s not like I can take over the entire album so it’s so I really wanted something that was just you know, third place in a way and yeah, we’re very was born as a side gig It was early hundred energy. thousand 16, early 2017 as a soccer game I saw gauge for around a year, people thought I was crazy because I had no life. But that’s cool. Because Yeah, it gave me the opportunity to really build the brand to the spice way It wasn’t just I was just typing on any jobs I could really be selective with, you know, the type of clients I want you to a weapon it because I wasn’t doing it just really for the money. Like I had a stable income from, you know, the corporate job I had. So the side gig really offered me the opportunity to work with people I really loved. And that helps me bro, I guess, our portfolio. And then by the time I had to choose between corporate job or my myself, I was like, and I was, let’s, let’s go, let’s give it a full on crack. And yeah, it really it really helps. I mean, it’s not for everyone to start their business as a side gig. But I personally think it’s a it’s a great way to, to start it. Because I think when people sometimes people jump full throttle and quit their job, and then start their business because of financial issues, or because they just like, Oh, I need to make you know this much money by this month, I’m just going to take on this job. And then they get sad, because they’re like, Oh, this is not really what I wanted.
Unknown 14:14 That’s so true. So much. I hundred percent believe that if people are going to start a business, they’re doing a side hustle first really prove that you can go all in and doing the jobs that you don’t necessarily like that you have to do to set up the business and to start making it profitable. If you don’t, if you aren’t willing to do that still, while you’re working full time or part time, then what makes you think you get a bit actually want to do it when you’re not like,
Unknown 14:39 Oh my gosh, yes. So true. So true. Yeah, Yeah, I cannot agree more than that. Because, yeah, it is going to be long hours owning your own business, your brain doesn’t really switch off. So it’s almost like the entree to the laptop. It’s it’s like, it’s so funny that you mentioned that because I think a lot of I love my girlfriends. And I think a lot of my friends do things. I bet that’s my life that I get to do you know, and sometimes look, I’m gonna lie. I do sometimes bring my laptop me at all, or I will work from a cafe. But it’s Yeah, it’s definitely not always rainbows.
Unknown 15:23 What would you say the best thing about being your own bosses,
Unknown 15:31 I would probably have to say it’s the ability to really paint my own path as true what I want to achieve. Like, if I want to achieve x y z I enjoyed that I can put towards a plan I could put towards, you know, the number of clans a tree going towards our path. Or if I want to switch things up, I can do that as well. If I want you to completely go and do something different. I can do that as well. And that is damn awesome. That is pretty awesome. Being able to really have full control of Yeah, watch. Life is going to look like what life is going to feel locked. And where the life well, even if I could be. Yeah. in Brisbane or Sydney. I could be one. It’s, you know, Unknown 16:23 it’s awesome. Yeah. That is so cool. I love it. So what would you say the hardest part about being your impulses. There’s definitely a number of hotspotsthat come to come to mind when it comes to owning a business I think the biggest one for me personally would really be the ability to switch off from business friend she just normal any of the brain because and I think you any business owner that is listening to this would completely understand when you’re a business owner, you are there is no work life balance. It’s it’s work life integration, your work becomes your life, your life in a way is you’re consumed by not because you have a lot of client work to do. It’s not just about that, it’s it’s mainly was thinking about, you know what else I can do, or how else I can make this better, or how I’m going to make that client experience even more awesome than previous, like, you’re always thinking of how to better ABC or how to make how to create something that your clients want. And sometimes, and this sucks life and I love my partner to base for this is my like, we would be sitting next to each other. And we would be talking and I would literally be typing and we’ll be talking I’ll be like, sorry, what I did not like my brain is not there because I’m in business mode. And in a way that is hard. That sucks. And I’m yeah, I’m so lucky to have a partner who really understands and is really supportive of that. That’s definitely the hardest food because unless you disconnect all internet or electronic devices, it’s so easy to checking emails. It’s so easy to jump on your phone and open the laptop up now those and just start working even on weekends.
Unknown 18:35 And so I’m going to mention your position also, like text, so much creative juices and so much space around the creative zone. Is there anything that you do to help yourself get into the creative zone? Or is it just something that free? You will Unknown 18:51 all man Unknown 18:52 Yeah, I definitely need to get better at this. And I think we were just chatting about this before. But I definitely the creative juices are definitely not always on 24 seven. And I think Unknown 19:06 anyone else that’s in the creative industry listening to this Unknown 19:10 well, understand, like, there’s definitely peaks for the communities, you know, magic. But there’s definitely there’s only so much creative juice that can be milked, you can’t help but sometimes go down the sun. So it’s really understanding for me, it’s really been trying to understand, you know, when the pizza and of course also understanding that it’s okay to know it’s okay to take that weekend off and recharge the creative juices. It’s okay to, you know, finish potentially at 4pm one day because you started at 5am. Like it’s it’s definitely being I think transitioning from corporate role to owning your own business. There is this idea that you have to still work nine to five because you feel like that’s what you need to do. But each each person has just it. It’s so different. Like, sometimes people are amazing. And the morning and if we wake up for you, you could finish up on Oh, three or four. If you are more of a model. You can start work every day and finish Layla. It’s just finding weighing the peaks of your creative juices common So to answer your question, it’s to be okay to recharge those creative juices. but to also find that when I guess my personal and whoever’s listening, like your creative juice is at its peak, because it’s different for everyone. Unknown 20:34 Yeah, absolutely. So you works alongside your corporate role for for quite a while for about a year doing you’re doing a side hustle. And then he went into full time and then at what point did you feel that you actually need to hire staff Unknown 20:48 I have play hide my stuff. And I’ll still in the corporate job. So there was yes, Unknown 20:54 I hired my Unknown 20:56 first time probably six months into side begging. And that was my life because I started to get times and of course, I only had why, like, have the weekend, Saturday and Sunday. And the job I was in was they were amazing to have given me either did a flexible work arrangement that allowed me to also Friday off work Monday to Thursday from six 7am till, like five very like compressed hours so that I can have a day off but still, I needed someone to help me, you know, ended my work and review you know, make sure the i’s are dotted the T’s are, you know, how stout so the first person I had was another editor and a copywriter result to really go through the work that I create first. So I had book first and then that was the first so then by the time I left my corporate role, I already had the amazing group and then it wasn’t until probably say four months into full time I then hired another Unknown 21:59 copywriter and strategic so that was, yeah, Michelle. And then the third was an admin person. I I do now looking back, I think I feel really bad for my admin girl because I’m like, I’m so sorry. All of my stuff is so Unknown 22:17 manual Unknown 22:20 bit of me is like, maybe I should have, you know, hide the Unknown 22:24 little bit early on, because now she has a lot of stuff to do. Unknown 22:32 Well, yeah. What do you feel that you’ve learned about yourself through the journey of actually managing staff down? Unknown 22:40 Um, wow, that’s it’s Unknown 22:44 hard. I think Unknown 22:45 the hardest part for me is I’m usually someone Unknown 22:51 really trust to be friends with everyone. I’m really someone who Unknown 22:57 Yeah, you know, I am able to going to networking events. I’m not one of those people who are like, show like, I will be there I’ll be like, Oh, hey, we are friends now. But it’s I guess it’s finding that balance between you know, making sure that you’re being the best you know, support or boss as still feel weird saying that being the best boss to yourself. But also of course, maintaining that relationship and someone friendship and then being okay with me giving them feedback or them being okay with me just letting them know hey, this should have been like this or this should have been done like this. Like that has been hard because sometimes I feel bad Unknown 23:39 I’m like, oh, but Unknown 23:41 yeah, I definitely have had to learn how to provide feedback and also understand that it is it’s it’s it’s a big thing to for someone to be part of a brand as well and you really need to not just sees them as just another copywriter or just I don’t know another admin person. It’s so much more than that. Because it’s Yeah, it’s you really need to get to understand this what I’ve learned like you really need to get understand what they want to do as well. Like, like, if the copywriter also wants to do this, then we can mold the role to it if that’s what she wants. Because that’s what how she’s going to perform her that’s so it’s really almost not putting the person into the job. It’s also molding the job to the person and you know, what they love doing and all that. Yeah, I’m still learning every day. I’m still running. Unknown 24:42 So is there anything in particular the deep bring you did hire With that in mind, Unknown 24:47 I’m Unknown 24:50 hustling. I definitely hire not on not necessarily on skill. I mean, skill is important. But it was definitely the attitude attitude is the most important thing. It’s like I just stick with my gosh, when it comes to hiring staff. Because you can always teach people how to do something. Of course, it may take longer if the person hasn’t got the experience. But if they’ve got the right attitude, or they’ve got the Grinch, like, it’s fine. Like they will be there’ll be there like rain or shine, like they will be there and there’ll be willing to learn but that that would definitely have been my biggest lining terms of hiring people for attitude and sticking with your God. And and you’ll you’ll feel it to like, even if you go out and hire someone or put out an ad to hire someone, you might have some amazing applications. And this is something that, you know, we we are this is from personal experience. We used to get some amazing applications, but you just don’t have that connection. Or you just don’t feel that person has got the right attitude. And you don’t have to jump in. Because it’s Yeah, if you’re a business owner, and you’re hiring. So this is your brand new baby you’re talking about. You know, so Unknown 26:09 make sure you got the right people because they’re the biggest Unknown 26:11 asset really, Unknown 26:13 absolutely. Because they’re also a reward for you. I could Yeah, I like it’s, it’s so important. I love I love that you’d actually considered that as well. When, when bringing someone on board. It’s not just about what you need, and the company needs. It’s actually about what they need to like, I really, really love that. That’s awesome. Unknown 26:31 Definitely. I think when when you a business or company able to not just satisfy someone professionally, but personally as like a staff member or whoever you’ve gotten, your team will be like, wow, like she doesn’t know he doesn’t just care about me because I can do the job. They actually care about my you know, you remember that stuff? My partner’s name what the cat’s name like older like the little things yeah, that stuff Unknown 27:03 really matters and it’s one of the key things that you know I think in this day and age people have started wanting to work for businesses or companies that have a purpose and that I’m making a difference in the world but also true that actually care about the progression I insolence one of the challenges I had throughout many using corporate was that real fine line of did actually did actually care about my about my future. Hundred percent. Yeah, come full lately. Get you? Yeah. It’s it’s hard. Because Yeah, like, like you mentioned, I think back in the corporate Well, I it’s definitely not saying this chair for for every single corporate organization. But there are definitely times where I’m just like, okay, so is this just the boxing thing Unknown 27:50 do you actually care about, you know, watch what, what I actually love doing? Or is this you just need to jump down night and people perform at their best when they work in an environment where they spend so much about Unknown 28:06 working Unknown 28:08 when it comes to corporate career, like more more time than you spend with your family, your friends, your pets, your you know, like, it’s important that that’s not you’re not just going there and Unknown 28:21 joining you Unknown 28:24 enjoy it. You really need to enjoy it and find purpose and feel great about it and not be like, Oh my god, I can’t wait until the weekend. You should feel pretty good about going to work on a Monday. Unknown 28:36 I really want to go back a little bit to your story you told about how you became a lawyer and you did social and organizational psychology. But it wasn’t that high. You say it was just very expensive pages and type a bunch How have you implemented some other things that you learned in that into your business? Now? Unknown 28:58 I would probably Yeah, that’s a great question. I would probably say the biggest thing are Blench would probably be the choices are just words, I think. And I’m saying this because I wrote a lot of essays and assignments, and, you know, exams and all of that. And it’s and I also did an elective under the psychology element on linguistics and language. And it’s interesting, just the choices of words and understanding the differences of words and the meanings behind it. And I use this example quite often because it’s, it’s true, but like the words huge and massive, they have similar meanings. But the latter sounds bigger, like it’s, it’s little things like that, and knowing what words to use, and this is going back to uni days, knowing what words to use your assignment to convey a certain feeling you want the reader to have, or the professor who was marking up that assignment, like using certain words and a meeting certain words to make sure that it’s just sharp and succinct, like, therefore. And that slide these are just weasel words a lot of the time, but we love to throw them in because it adds to the word tell, but it’s it’s little. Yeah, little things like that. It’s Yeah, little things like that. Because I think one of the key things like even with my business coaching clients, sometimes they we get to a point in our lives where we start a new business or we start a new venture and then we think we need to discount everything that we’ve learned in the past or the skill new ever had Yeah, it’s interesting how those types of really keeping the glad that possibly at the time you didn’t think are really important. But now you look back on it and go Wow, that was really key on how I can utilize that now. Yeah, no, it’s it’s it’s so true because I think even though the beginning of the chat today I was like oh my god, two very expensive pieces of paper but I definitely like I mentioned I do not regret it because I’m definitely lunch so a lot from you know, even just talking like public speaking was something that I did not necessarily in the same you know same topic like but in law we had to do minutes we had to do you know, talk also go to the in my role in law firms like they had to go to the cord injury mentions in front of a judge like being able to not be scared to be in front of people that that used to be something I was very scared of public speaking or just speaking in general because Unknown 31:36 you you it’s natural I guess like a lot of the time 90% of people are quite scared of public speaking or speaking in general so going through that worth experiences unique experiences even in high school even it’s all little bits of it has all come into like together like a puzzle to you know and and I’m still learning I’m still getting I’m still learning from what I’m doing now and piecing it all together again so definitely do not discount you know even if it’s a completely different Korea that you’ve been in I was I was completed in Korea there are going to be a little elements of it that you can definitely and you might not realize but there’s going to be little elements of it that you can definitely implementing a business and sometimes it’s that one little thing that you completely discount that could make you completely unique. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So what would you say some of the do’s and don’ts or some things that you see copywriters, not copywriters, what in regional segment but black Unknown 32:44 in regards to copywriting? Unknown 32:47 In regards to copywriting, what would you say some do’s and don’ts on Unknown 0:09 um, I would probably say the biggest mistake I see people doing is they write, they seem copywriting or content in general as either a ticking the box, or just about communicating something about what they do clearly or succinctly. Which is definitely true. It’s very important to be able to communicate what you’re doing clearly. And 16 people need to understand what you do. But I think what a what a lot of people don’t realize it, that’s no longer enough. If you really want to stand out in your industry. And let’s be honest, we didn’t know we didn’t start a business to blending. So if you really want to stand out in your industry, you really need to craft something and really understand your consumers not bright as though I think this is gonna sound cool, or I think this is going to make sense, but really right to your audience, you’re not writing for yourself, you’re writing for them, they need to craft a message that is going to really connect with them, that’s going to resonate with them, that’s going to stick with them, because they’re going to do research on other people that are going to be doing what you do. Unknown 1:25 Yes, truth bomb, there are competitors. And even if you’ve got the most amazing new idea that not many people have, yet other people are going to say what you do and think, hey, that’s pretty awesome. I can totally do that. And that’s why it’s not it’s not enough just to say what you do. Clearly, you really need to craft a message that is so strong and memorable that they’re going to remember you after all the research that they do on your competitors. Yeah, that would be Unknown 1:56 john cena do and how would you say like, I actually really love how you inject humor into a lot of work to a lot of what you do. And it’s like, even just the way that your website comes up with, hey, I’m actually fully booked for the rest of 2018 and then like to put little button saying, push not cool. Unknown 2:16 You’re like that is Yeah, that’s that’s legit. me because Unknown 2:21 I’m very Yeah, Unknown 2:24 I would be that person that would actually Yeah, me too. Me. Right. And I actually saw an article that you weren’t in the business cheeks Unknown 2:34 magazine. And it was about how to create you’re out of office message on your email, which I thought was so different. It was so unique in the way that you let the story really excite creative. I just really loved them got lots of every single one of them. How important do you think humor is in copywriting? Unknown 2:53 Look, I humor is important for our branch. Because it is a voice that’s part of our brand is kind of trying to voice we like change actually bit of tongue in cheek, sometimes not too much. But to answer your question, it really depends on your your brand. I mean, you could if you were a brand that is Unknown 3:17 quite serious, or your your target audience like executives and big corporates, and yet your brand that caters purely to that then if you talk a bit true tongue in cheek, or if you talk about a little bit too, you know, funny when it comes to a serious manner, then people might be like, Oh, that’s a little bit inappropriate, or that’s not really funny. Or they might just not be appeal to that. Like, it’s really important that you craft a tone of voice based on not what you think is going to work emotional, again, what your audience is going to be appeal to. So human works for our audience. Because we like to Unknown 3:59 Yeah, I haven’t been Unknown 4:00 having a little bit of fun when it comes to writing words for, you know, businesses and organizations. I think a lot of the time when it comes to writing words, people get overwhelmed he Paul alone, or God, I don’t want to do this. But I have to well, we want to make a little bit of fun as opposed to more of a daunting task. But that definitely doesn’t mean every single brand should adopt the dash of humor. And it really depends on your audience and whether or not they’re going to appeal to that. Hmm. And I mentioned in your role, being able to really build a really strong relationship with your clients is quite key, Unknown 4:39 obviously, with the way that you attract a lot of business as well. I would imagine quite a quite a lot of issues with barrels. Well, is that true? Unknown 4:46 Yeah, I would probably say 80%, 80%, 70% of our Unknown 4:54 like, workload is referrals, which is absolutely amazing. And I feel so honored to have, you know, clients that refer us or just say, people who have not even worked with us, which that is just absolutely yeah, even more amazing. Unknown 5:10 Its relationships is a key component of I mean, along with a lot of other businesses, I’m sure they would say the same relationships are very important to us hustling, and mainly because I think at the end of the day, people should get it is like the old fashioned way of doing business. And I know there’s internet, their social media, there’s additional marketing and all that. But a big chunk of why people do business or why people do business with certain people all go back to relationships in a way or that connection, really not not so much relationship, but that connection and whether or not that’s done through relationships, whether or not that’s done through another type of, you know, thing that you offer, maybe you do handwritten notes or maybe you too Unknown 6:03 cold to your clients after your mortgage broking your 40 of clients after they have settled on the home or something like that. Like it’s it’s just going back to the old birds and really understanding at the end of the day. We’re all humans here. Like we Yeah, we’re all humans and way it should never feel like a transaction. Unknown 6:25 I think honestly, speaking from from experience as well in relation to that, like having that true connection in a place where it’s actually just getting to know another human being and not like when I really felt some when I first met you at an event was that you’re actually interested in another human being, it wasn’t about, Hey, this is what I do. It was actually Unknown 6:45 Hey, Unknown 6:46 what’s happening and we just had a really beautiful chat, just so not really that, you know, you can be in situations where we’re constantly always talking business or its field, very transactional, so I think Yeah, really well. So Unknown 7:03 thank you. I think it’s, I think that’s another way to look at change in terms of networking events in general, like we shouldn’t, people put a lot of pressure when it comes to going to, or people are scared of going to networking events, sometimes like themselves, because they’re like, Oh, my God, what I say. But if you just approach it based on the fact that, hey, you’re just making some connection, you’re not trying to do a hot page or hard sell majority of people don’t like the hard sell, by the way, but you’re just trying to get to know people who knows? Like, if something comes out of it, right? If nothing, then that’s fine. Sure. You still got to connect with someone? And who knows, they might have a brother or sister or even if they don’t, that’s fine. You just got to know someone, and you might have just learned something from them. Unknown 7:45 So in that sense, yeah. And even remind them to become a client of yours. Like you said before, they could actually just be a supporter with a connected with the right well, they recommend you refer you so yeah, never. You never know what’s going to come out of it. But it can come from that place of needing that client or needing that referral mass. And I come from a nice slice nine, Unknown 8:06 and you’ll you’re just putting pressure on yourself. It’s just Unknown 8:10 absolutely. There’s nothing more awkward than being like, Oh, my God, I’m going to slip my business card in right about now. Yeah, okay. Unknown 8:21 Sorry. True. Like, I’ve looked invaded events, and someone’s given me a business card. And I’m like, Oh, I’m your ideal client. But I don’t even know what. Unknown 8:31 Oh, my gosh, I’ve had so many. Yeah, I’ve personally had a number of experiences. And it’s, it’s almost like I and it’s even more funny, I guess, when they Yeah, they that’s the first thing I do. This is my this is like, Who Unknown 8:45 You Are you like, why do you love doing what you do live in? Like, Unknown 8:48 people want to know, stuff like that to not just about what you do? Unknown 8:53 Absolutely. So is there any, any key things that you feel like you’ve done this year that it really helped to grow your business where it is now? Unknown 9:02 Um, I would have to say maybe two things. I will probably say Unknown 9:12 I Unknown 9:14 getting a mental that’s one. And the other one is getting and counting, Unknown 9:23 getting confident in my numbers. Because Oh, my gosh, my number gang is not great. Unknown 9:29 And yeah, as a business owner, you need to know your numbers. Sorry, if you can’t throw up and find someone Unknown 9:35 who Unknown 9:36 will dissect all of that lingo to you. So that at least you know, the important stuff. So that has definitely been something that I’ve, Unknown 9:46 yeah, I’ve done this year. And Unknown 9:48 it’s, it’s helped me tremendously, because I’m just, I guess a lot of the time you’re like, Okay, so I guess money is coming in, but it’s also going out, but like, Am I making a profit like that? That is just one question. But like, Well, how do I what what service offering or what product offering is actually generating the biggest ROI life what or when it comes to advertising? Like, I spent this money from advertising isn’t even working? Or should I just keep pushing money down the drain like, so it’s understanding and numbers is Unknown 10:19 one thing I wasn’t good at. Unknown 10:21 But one thing I invested in uncannily, or just a financial advisor which has really helped me Unknown 10:29 up level of my numbers game and we chat every quarter we we review everything and see how we can chickens better and all that that accountability as well. Unknown 10:41 Great, awesome. And what will you keeping that you learned from your mental Unknown 10:49 number of things, I think the biggest thing is Unknown 10:53 two things. One, success is defined so differently into so many people. And I’m still trying Personally, I’m still trying to find my definition of success. I feel like I Unknown 11:06 a lot of the time people jump towards, you know, if you make this lunch, you’re successful. But it’s not necessarily that I think a part of what I think success for me personally, is, is probably in a way freedom, like freedom to do what I want when I want as well as you mentioned, travel, to see my family to see my friends. And so of course, have a business that runs so really, that every person has their own definition of success. And that it’s not always about money, Unknown 11:39 and that you can like do it all. But you can’t do it all at once. Unknown 11:46 That’s another thing. I think I have a lot of ideas for the brand and what we want to do, but definitely try not to it, Unknown 11:59 what would you say some of the best advice you’ve ever been given is, Unknown 12:03 um, it would have to be focused on one thing and Unknown 12:07 focus Unknown 12:08 and do it well. So I think a lot of the time businesses and myself included at the beginning of the word fatty journey, we this is spoiler alert, like, we focus on a lot of different elements. But and that probably last in the last few months, Unknown 12:27 until I realized, Unknown 12:28 okay, I am trying to put my hands on all these different baskets, when really I just should just focus on one thing, I think a lot of the time people seem to be just focus on one thing, and losing on all these other clients watch, if you focus on one thing, and they shouldn’t be a master and being known as the go to forge then that in a way is a ripple effect as well. That is even stronger than focusing on you know, we could have focused on copywriting and PR and marketing and advertising and Facebook ads and photography Unknown 13:01 and life. You know, we put a focus on so much but Unknown 13:05 I think it’s just about getting clear on what you do and what you do best. And Unknown 13:11 knowing that Unknown 13:13 the same as the go shoot for that you don’t have to do it all to be seen Unknown 13:17 unless that is what we want to do. Okay. And unless that is what you want to do. But Unknown 13:21 yeah, I’m do not feel like you have to do that. Unknown 13:24 Because some people do actually think like, come from a place of will I can do that. So I should be doing that. Yeah, Unknown 13:31 you want to do Unknown 13:33 yeah, that was definitely myself as well. full transparency. I I we recently had our best day event and I actually told everyone who came to the event we had a bit of a I screwed up panels and my little spiel was that when we first start with Betty we actually is which is good but now you guys are about you know Unknown 13:58 we actually offered a random service that was for audio transcription very very random yeah but at the beginning I was like you know I can we can talk Austin’s this has to do with words. Unknown 14:13 So why don’t we offer it no one zero? Unknown 14:17 Absolutely. No one ever inquired about it. It was all copywriting clients that came to us and I was like, Okay, well, the Tron has spoken. I am going to get rid of it. Because I should have never introduced this I hadn’t been feeling about it at the beginning. And this just consensys So Unknown 14:34 yeah, don’t don’t feel like you need to put on your Unknown 14:37 hands baskets. Just because you can do it like you really love doing it. Yeah. And you feel you’re being able to really trust that gut feeling now Unknown 14:47 Yes, I’m getting so much better out of that thing. Unknown 14:51 It has been sometimes I need to be reminded, but I definitely am a big believer in trusting your gut it’s always every single time I didn’t trust my god it’s always been like okay I should have asked me Unknown 15:04 that God does not lie. Yeah, Unknown 15:09 you’re right like you have to kind of feel the oneness and test it and yeah yeah. Need to screw up to get that feeling of Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Like I really love this point that I’ve come across itself Yeah, it’s never fail. Yeah always a lesson So true. Christine So what’s next wordfetti? Unknown 15:34 Um. Well, thankful and I like it too. Unknown 15:37 Well, yes, holiday Unknown 15:39 holiday entree. And then for main course, it will be we’re really wanting to dive into I guess the education space. So that’s you know, running workshops and teaching people how to do exactly what we do because it’s a skill copywriting is a skill I think that’s important not just for obviously other copywriters but also for business owners for, you know, marketing managers, to even organizations in general. And that’s, again, not just to communicate what you do clearly. And frankly, the ability to really get under the surface and craft a message that is not going to be replicable and all that. And I really think everyone has the ability to do that. They just need the tools and the resources to help them get there. So we’re going to be this is exciting, because it’s the first time I’ve actually said it. But we’re, yeah, we’re launching workshops next next year under our brand. And we’ll also be doing workshops like tailored workshops for corporates, and we may or may not have something as well that runs with forecast or pocket that baby Christine Love it. Love it. Love it. Love it. Awesome. Sorry. Last question. Just to bring it all back around. Is there a key thing that you have lines in your journey throughout your whole business journey that you would like someone else was wanting to go out onto the space of opening and are starting their own business? What advice would you give them? Anita 17:15 I would have to say, you really, really have to 150% believe in what you’re about to this business idea. And business venture you do. I personally giant think someone should start a business just just because they’re like you know, that sounds like the next cool thing. Let’s go with that and start a business from that you really need to believe in it as well. Because things will go wrong, things will not go, you know, perfect. And the only way for you to stand back up is if you really have the belief and the idea that this you know what this, this is wanted, this is something that the market wants. So I’m going to keep going, you really need to have that drive and believe in what you do, so that you can really bring yourself back up because there’s been so many times that I’ve been pushed down as well. I’ve been you’re going to get rejected, you’re going to have people you know, so things that are not, you know, fantastic to hear. And you’re gonna have people you know, say mean things to you for no reason at all. But you cannot let that Yeah, get to you at all. And the only way for us not to get to have that you know, cloud your mind is when you have such a clear idea of why you do what you do. So, yeah, that would be advice. Christine 18:42 Love it. Love it. Thank you so much. I really, really enjoyed this conversation today. Terry, thank you so much for having me. It’s been my pleasure. I just want to acknowledge you for everything you’ve achieved so far with Freddie like honestly, it’s incredible to see that you’ve not only worked your butt off doing your side hustle but then also created this beautiful little company with cool people at work alongside and your message is just so strong so I really really want to just technology for that so well done. Unknown 19:09 Thank you so much that yeah, that really meaningful. Thank you. Unknown 19:13 I thank you so much for joining me today.
Is it time to let go of all the stories from the past? All the reasons you can or cannot do the things you want to do.
Is it time to give yourself a fresh new start? You can choose to continue to believe those stories or you can put them down and choose never to pick them up again.
There are so many incredible things happening in this world that we can to choose to experience, but we are easily persuaded that the world is imploding. Yet there are incredible people doing amazing things and the best part – we get to be one of them.
It’s time to choose.
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Kate Toon is an Award-winning SEO copywriter and SEO consultant, With over two decades of experience in all things advertising, digital and writing she has worked with big brands such as eHarmony, Curash and Kmart. And she’s helped countless small businesses produce great content, improve their copy writing and SEO to find success in business.
Kate recently published her popular business book, The Confessions of a Misfit Entrepreneur, and is the host of 2 Podcast shows – Hotcopy -the secrets of successful copywriters & The recipe for SEO Podcast.
Originally from the UK but now based just outside Sydney, Kate is also the founder of The Clever Copywriting School and The Recipe for SEO Success eCourse and is the founder of The Copywriting Conference – Australia’s first dedicated Copywriting Conference.
We covered so many fun topics including:
Be sure to check out all things Kate Toon via her site – http://www.katetoon.com/
And check out her courses and podcasts here:
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Christine 0:05 Well, welcome to the podcast Kate. I’m so excited to get into this conversation today. Kate 0:11 I’m excited to be here. Sorry, there was a bit of a pause there. But I was like, Yes, it’s good to be here. Hello. Christine 0:19 So I was literally just saying to you, I was down the whole vortex of everything Kate Toonis all about and I’m so excited, and I’m impressed and just blown away with everything that you do, and everything that your business encompasses. So just to get started, Could you just tell us a little bit about your journey of becoming an entrepreneur and how that’s been happening for the last however many I don’t want to have to put years on it but however many years that’s been Kate 0:48 it’s been it’s actually been about 10 years I should I should work that out I’m sure LinkedIn will send me a reminder to tell me at some point but it’s been about 10 years and the first five or six I was a copywriter purely focusing on doing SEO copywriting for big brands around Australia and around the world and that went really well like I was doing pretty well as decent money but you know there’s only so many hours in the week and you get to the point where you can charge so much and I realized that that was going to limit not so much my earning potential but my freedom like you know I had to work all the hours I had, to make the money but I mean so about seven years ago I decided to start looking into you know, multiple income sources and passive income hahaha and I’ll talk about that a bit more I’m sure but you know so that’s when I went down the route of setting up other businesses. So the clever copywriting school which teaches copywriters to be better copywriters and the recipe for SEO success which teaches small business owners and solid colors how to get to grips with Google. And then from there other things popped up podcast books, courses, memberships, shops, you name it, speaking, conferences, events, workshops, and it’s all kind of snowballed, and I’m stuck in the vortex of Kate Toon. You can get out again. But I can’t Kate 2:09 pity. pity me. Christine 2:11 So what would you say the best part of your week is? Kate2:15 I love doing, I love to podcast like this. I love chatting to other business owners, making connections for me this year has really been about making connections with other business people and finding friends and common interest. So I love that I love speaking I spoken at 37 events and show Kate 2:34 I know it’s insane. But it was a deliberate strategy to get over my fear. And to actually get to the point where I love it. Like, I enjoy it. I get like, get up on stage. Like I’m like, I’m Beyonce, saying you know, it strut my stuff. And you should see me two years ago, I kind of shuffled on stage, shaking. And so yeah, I think I think speaking, speak I love the sound of my own voice. Christine. It’s terrible. Christine 2:57 But I think to you have so much value to offer. When I saw you speak at an event here in Brisbane, it was you know, I love how you bring all the humor into it. And I love it how you just real but you still add a lot of value. Is that something that you are really focused on? Kate 3:13 Yeah, I mean, I loathe going to see speakers or listening to podcast where it’s all just abstract fluff and nonsense. I really like to get into the nitty gritty, I’ll be very honest about my failures and successes and the literal how I did it. But you know, I think a lot of entrepreneurs, they kind of show the magic trick. And really, what you want to see is how they did the magic trick. And that, to do that, you’ve got to pay for that seven figure course. You know, I don’t want to do that. So I feel like I have enough knowledge that I can give a chunk of it away, and the still going to be more you know, I’m not going to run out. Do you know what I mean? And, you know, it’s not going to by me helping other people and sharing my knowledge. It’s not going to stop people buying from me, or using me or wanting my services, there’s enough to go around to, you know, and, and the humor and stuff is, I just think people take business very seriously and take themselves very seriously. And if you’re not, you won’t have any of this. You should say it’s state of me today. Like literally like I’ve been dragged to the hedge. It’s just, you know, we’re not all polished, beautiful, competent beings. Most of us are struggling. And I just think that honesty is it’s reassuring, to be honest. Christine 4:23 Yeah. Real. Absolutely. Yeah. And I love how you said that. Because it’s something that you were saying how and that you not necessarily have to know all the answers and, you know, figure it out along the way. But I love it, how you consistently add lots of value. And so many people are so scared to do that early on in their journey. When you have Do you often have people aske you that, like, you know, I don’t want to give away too much that people won’t pay for what I’m going to give them. Kate 4:53 How do yeah, I mean, I think at the end of the day, most everything we need to know is on the Google, you know, like someone selling an Instagram course telling you how to do this, I did all I if I really wanted to find out, I could read 50 blog posts. And I know probably as much as the person and but the differences is the lived experience. I think that really does help. And, and also, you know, even if you tell someone how to do a thing, most people don’t want to do it themselves. They can’t be bothered, you know, so they’ll always be people want your services. And look there will be a small percentage of people who will take your free stuff, your advice, you have knowledge, and they will never buy from you, you know, just they just never will. But you can run your business worrying about those people. And funnily enough, I, you know, I have a group for Facebook to give SEO tips. And I see people join that group. And some of them have been there for years and asked me literally hundreds of questions and never bought a thing. And it almost, you know, a couple years ago, got to a point like I’m going to delete them at the group. This is not our listeners. Not that and then whatever. I’ve had that thought. And next round, they bought these calls. Not me, I hadn’t said anything. But sometimes it takes people like 2,3, 4 years to get to the position where they have the time, the money, that inclination to work with you. I’ve even had people send me emails going, finally, I have something I can work on. You will have been following me to two years now. And if you caught this, but you know what I mean? And yeah, that people are waiting. So yeah, I’d never be afraid about giving too much away. My only advice to be focus more on the water in the wise and maybe keep a little bit of the how back. Yeah, so I talk a lot about what SEO is why it’s important, why you should be doing it. But the how, keep a little bit of that back, because that’s my expertise, then you could talk a lot around your subject without giving away all your secrets. Christine 6:44 But there’s just something about that. How is it isn’t it funny how all the information is there, but people still want someone else to do it for them all. They still need their hand held as they do it, Kate 6:54 or they need to explained in a different way. I read some stuff that said, people need to hear something seven times before it goes into their brain. And, you know, maybe they’re breathable. I mean, I can’t tell you how many blog posts I’ve read about Instagram, for example, none of it stuck in my head. I’ve got folders full of articles I intend to read. And then you know, you have a 10 minute chat with an expert. And they tell you one or two things and you implement those one or two things. And that’s the difference because sometimes it’s not about what you need to do. It’s like if I could do one thing, what should I do? Because really only got time to do one thing. And then what’s the next thing? So it’s the order the priority and the impact I think we can really get help from from an expert either. Unknown 7:36 Yeah, absolutely. So he tells us about how you have created the success in your business. And you mentioned before that it’s literally without paying for much advertising at all. Unknown 7:47 Yeah, so I saw strangely against paying for ads. I don’t know why I’ve got a little bit of Google remarketing. And I tried one Facebook campaign about three years ago for my my course. But even then, it was a meet somebody who one person you bought, and that campaign was on my list. So I already might be my customer. So I kind of feel a bit like, That’s not fair. We got them anyway. Unknown 8:12 It’s just simply like spending money. It’s not that I’m tight. But like, I’m like, Well, you know, every round I run the course I’m like, this is the round where I’m going to have to pay that because surely I’ve tapped out my audience. Now there’s no less. But inside this round that actually got someone to set up some Google ads and some remarketing. And on the morning, I launched my course I emailed him and said, the consensys going and then by the time they email me back that already sold out. So it was like, Whoa, yeah, Unknown 8:45 I need and what it does, I think is it it is actually a story that helps my brand because I built my business on SEO and content marketing. And I’m teaching people how to do SEO and content marketing. If I was getting people on my course, by paying thousands of dollars for ads, it would kind of negate what I’m trying to sell. You know what I mean? So it’s almost the proof of my pudding. And so yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s been interesting. It’s pretty much all through SEO, that’s how I built it. And now very much Facebook, social media, Facebook groups, that’s where I put my focus these days. Unknown 9:16 What’s your focus when it comes to content marketing, Unknown 9:21 I don’t have focus when it comes to content marketing. So I’m not a planner. And I don’t have any kind of content marketing strategy. I don’t have a plan. I don’t map out my Instagram posts for the next 60 days. I don’t, I don’t know what I’m going to blog about next week. I have no idea what I’m doing. Next one, I really just do what I felt like doing on The Daily Show you that’s the joy the joy of what we do. I mean, I have themes I talk about copywriting and SEO, I have a tone of voice and I have values. So but then we’ll just need which means I don’t have to refer to some brand guidelines. Think about what I’m going to post because I just post whatever comes into my head. And I very Don’t worry too much about you know, this post doesn’t go off. Who cares? The next one, like I just, I just don’t care. I just if you look, if you’ve been in the vortex, you’ll see that it’s quite sporadic. Like some days, I’ll post 20 things The next day, nothing. I’ll post a really great SEO tips, then the next five posts will be pictures of my dog. And it all seems to seems to work I Unknown 10:19 don’t know about. Unknown 10:21 But I think I sound like I’m clueless. But I do know how it’s because it’s that word. I’m going to do our fingers. It’s authentic and real. And I’m in you know, I think people can tell that can see the enthusiasm what I do. I love social media. I love talking to people online and having a gig or having some bands sharing useful stuff. That’s silly stuff. And, and I think that enthusiasm and positivity comes through. And that’s what makes it work. Yeah, it’s it’s inconsistent. It’s a bit messy, and make a lot of spelling mistakes. But the divide is good. You know, Unknown 10:54 something’s people’s bullshit meters. It’s just Unknown 10:59 it’s so attuned now, like because we’re so sick of being sold to. We’re so sick of you can really read the posts that people have spent so long putting together and I can’t even deal with reading a post that longer than three paragraphs, understand either way too much time into it. I can’t even deal and sometimes like without events that we do. And the girl that I ran them with, she’ll do the posts, and sometimes so long. I’m like, dude, I didn’t want to read that. Unknown 11:26 Yeah, I know, I mean, all of it. Like, I write some of my best posts while I’m cooking in the evening, and I’m having a glass of wine. And I write them and they come out really well, because I’m not in business mode. And in different mode when friends slipped sideways a little bit. And yes, obviously, I read them and the next morning, and that’s sort of typos, but the message is there and those ones go down really, really well. The ones where I gave a really amazing, useful SEO tip with insight and stats, tumbleweeds, no clicks on that no one likes them. I think, you know, especially on Facebook. I don’t know if we necessarily that to learn and I always can be salty. I think that have a good time. I think we’re there to have a good time and mate, mate, mate, finance, you know, go to LinkedIn. If you want to learn stuff. It’s boring as hell. And but, you know, if you really want to learn stuff, you do a course you read a blog, but Facebook, I think it’s just about interaction and having fun and being memorable Unknown 12:22 across the nation tool. Yeah, but it works. You know, it works. It works. Awesome. So tell me, at what point in your business did you figure that you needed to stop working towards time versus money? Unknown 12:36 I think it’s something I’m still I’m still working on. So last year, I had like, an amazing, amazing, I’m not very good at math, but I own five times as much as the year before. So it’s a huge leap for me. And, and, and it was really on satisfactory. Sounds really bad, doesn’t it? Like the years you know, I’d be like, I need to crack it’s bigger. Why I made that figure out. But no, it’s just some random figure. And then you crack it and you realize an awful lot of money doesn’t actually come back to you. Unknown 13:03 Because, you know, Unknown 13:04 even though I’m a limited company, and I do profit first and split my money up, you know, it’s not like about buying a Lamborghini and if you point to some, I did contrived Unknown 13:15 and it was, it was like, Okay, great. I made some money. Now what you know, and so I think this year, it’s been more about I really want to enjoy my life a little bit more about my business life and my personal life. I love my business. I’m not one of these people is like, you know, you’ve got to work to live, not live to work. I love my business. I love coming into my office. I love what I do. And I’ve no shame about that. But not what I did was quite boring. So this year, I spent a lot of time traveling, speaking at events, running workshops. Networking, does it make noodles of money? No. Do I enjoy it? Yes. And it’s I wanted to that balance a bit more so and probably still spending the same amount of time we still going to make similar money. But I just wanted to ask you to join levels. I want to have some fun, because otherwise, I’m going to go and work for the man. You know, like if the fun levels I’m trying to increase. Unknown 14:07 Yeah, that’s awesome. That’s a great perspective. Like, otherwise, why the hell even here? Like, I know, the thing is, it’s Unknown 14:14 a luxury. And, you know, speaking events is an expensive business, because you don’t often get paid, you know, maybe travel cover costs that covers your hotel, sometimes you get a fee, but very rarely. And you know, even when I run workshops, I don’t charge the earth. I’m not making gazillion dollars. But it’s just exciting as let’s go to another city state. And I say, Tell me able to meet people, share your knowledge, get that feedback at face to face interaction. I love it. And in great this year, I’ve really enjoyed it. Unknown 14:45 That’s awesome. So what have you learned about yourself during that journey of Unknown 14:51 public speaking? Unknown 14:53 I’m a lot actually. I mean, I, that’s why I delivered so much. And I wanted to be able to walk on stage and just feel super confident. You know, I wanted to know, I can always tell me the night before thinking about my presentation. And, you know, I’ve learned that you will get heckled I’ve been here called a few times, I’ve been asked questions that I actually had no idea what the answer was. And it was, it’s okay, it’s fine that you get through and, and, you know, I love that people don’t really understand what a lot of people don’t understand what public speaking is about. They try and disseminate as much information as possible. I like the like, I’ve got to make people take loads of this information in and their slides are covered and bullets and text, it’s a performance it’s a performance speaking and some people walk away with maybe one or two things that they remember from your actual presentation that people are there to be entertained. They are there to be educated but honestly if you want to be educated will read a blog post will do an online course and that an event I need some pizzazz I want someone on stage he doesn’t claim to the lectern and reader knows I want someone who leaps about that makes a joke, makes it fun has engaging slides. I think that’s what I’ve realized that it is a performance and it’s not about the presentation like the presentations 30 minutes, but I’m at the amendment for two full days. It’s everything else that I do at the event that makes the difference. You know, do I get drunk good at the after party who I sit next to it lunch what you know who I bump into? I talked to so that’s the real benefit. I think. And I think people don’t see that that’s the real benefit. Hmm, Unknown 16:27 very true. So what would you say one of your biggest challenges has been over the last 10 years Unknown 16:33 I think the challenge has have changed and you know early years it was having a baby I started my business when I was five months pregnant. So the first year I was you know, food feeding and with one arm and typing with the other and then a lot of financial difficulties you know, I got in debt with the tax office I had that whole feast and famine thing going on and having lots wonder no money that lots of money than no money and dealing with difficult clients for a long time and I thought great when I stopped being a copywriter I’ll have no clients but what I’ve done is exchange for clients a month or two two and a half thousand clients and different courses and so now i think it’s it’s what my friend Carrie X to call summit syndrome and not but I’m you know, hugely fabulously successful. But I’ve kind of ticked off everything I wanted to do. Like I’ve got to the top of the mountain and either I create another mountain to climb or sit on this existing mountain or a client back down. I don’t know. So it’s bit like now it’s like what next? You know, because I’m a person who needs a carrot on the end of this thick otherwise the stick just becomes a stick to beat myself when I’m searching for my next carrot right now. That’s that’s what that’s what my current issues do you find yourself Unknown 17:46 Do you really struggle on finishing things? or do something that you love starting things? Or is it the maintaining that you struggle Unknown 17:52 I think I’m pretty No one likes finishing things, let’s be honest, your love starting them and but I’m pretty good at forcing myself to complete things. For me, it’s, it’s the maintenance. So for example, I have this big SEO course there’s 100 videos and 40 worksheets hundred videos. And the problem with SEO is it changes and and it’s changed quite a lot in the last year. The whole ethos so shifted the whole mentality or shifted. So it’s not like I can replace individual videos where there’s a character count wrong or button in the wrong place. It’s like I need to change the voice of the whole course. So I’m not looking forward to that. So I’ll be sending my January doing and I will do my time and I will sit down I will remove all those videos because then that pays for me to enjoy the rest of the year. If you want to make sentences built. Once it’s done, I sell it three times a year. That’s the majority man Come on, Mike all pretty much all my income on three days of the year. And so it’s worth the effort Unknown 18:49 now. Unknown 18:50 Yeah, and then maintaining it. And the analogy I use is, you know, like if you’re a pop star, and you’ve got famous for singing this number one song and every time you turn off at a gig that’s what people want to hear. And you’re like you about all this new material when you Unknown 19:02 album no one cats and that’s Unknown 19:05 and sometimes I do get a bit like I can’t talk about SEO anymore. And but if I give myself a break. I’m talking a lot about conversion, copyright and sales pages and pages this year. And then I can come back to SEO again because it gets boring you know, doing the same thing every day Unknown 19:23 to talk actually at the last event that I saw you about sales and how much you actually love sales. Was it about sales that you learn all about the conversion writing that you love? Unknown 19:33 Well, I think a lot of people put off sales because I think it’s sleazy and like American infomercial, Lee and you know, big claims and oh my god this is the best course ever. But really for me it’s about having conversations and really understanding what makes your customers tick and then writing really conversational copy like I love to write as I talk slightly better than I talk just for some reason I sound a bit copy and this interview I don’t know why Unknown 20:00 I just love making that connection is a I’m a copywriter at heart I love being able to put together you know you put together a beautiful sentence you read that back and you go Unknown 20:10 oh Unknown 20:10 that was a good sentence all that was a good joke. I love that and so you know that’s what I’m trying to focus on that moment teaching people how to sell without feeling like they’re being sleazy like they’re lying like that over promising because you’re not really when someone hits your sales page, all they’re looking for is reassurance reassurance that the decision they’re about to make is the right one reassurance that the money they’re going to spend is going to be well spent. And you can reassure them because you believe in what you’re as long as you believe in what you’re selling and you think the offering something good and all you’re doing is explaining that someone who wants to hear and when you take that approach it becomes a conversation not a pitch you know I think pitching is where people are trapped in a room being sold to and they don’t want to be in its proper conversion copywriter is chatting someone through their objections, their fears and just explaining them away and helping them feel better about the decision that they already kind of want to make. You Unknown 21:05 know You make it sound so easy Yeah. After Unknown 21:10 I literally get stuck in that copywriting headspace of this. None of this is making sense. Is there any key suggestions that you have for someone writing copy? Unknown 21:20 Yeah, I mean, I think the biggest the biggest, the biggest one is that like, record yourself, take notes and have a chat with someone else and have them ask you questions about your product. Like, who’s it for? And what’s good about it, and what am I going to get out of it. And you literally just all Unknown 21:37 add up your Bible icon babbling a little bit now. Unknown 21:39 And then record that don’t read scope transcribed. And you’re gonna be some gems in there. And some real Idioms and Expressions that only you use, you know, we’ve all got a little weird phrases and turns of phrase, so the things you need to put in your copies and its really essentially very you it’s not vanilla, I think the worst thing people can do is, you know, have someone else’s sales page up and try and not look, copy it bigger. Like all they’ve got this, I should have this, they’ve got this, you know, they’re reading their language. And it just doesn’t sound like you. Because, you know, when someone buys from you, whatever you’re selling, ultimately, they’re probably going to connect with you. Yeah, so someone buys my course now then doing my course they’re going to see 100 videos of me going to hear my voice for Unknown 22:23 our words, Unknown 22:24 if it’s not the same experience on the sales page is going to be a disconnect like true though I try and make myself page almost like very me. Like I think the first line on my pages like SEO is a giant pain in the bum, isn’t it? You know, now that will not appeal to everybody and won’t appeal to your seat the straight business person, but I don’t want them because they’re going to hate the course they’re going to hate me and they’re going to leave unhappy and it’s something I say all the time to coming a bit of a mantra but good marks and good sales is as much about repelling as it is about attracting I want people who want me to send are going to be happy with me. I don’t want people who are a bit indecisive and they’re thinking like, Well, I’m not sure she doesn’t seem a good go away. Don’t I don’t want you because you’ll end up being a customer that hates the experience. And then I have an awful emotional time with you. And then you’ll go away and say bad things about me. So you know, to me Unknown 23:15 completely, Unknown 23:16 cut them out Quick, get rid of them quick and just get the people who are really wanting, you know, yeah, Unknown 23:20 let’s see. And I think I often tell clients like don’t be, don’t be fearful of people dropping off the email they select. Don’t be scared of people writing comments that aren’t necessarily positive. Like if they’re not your people. They want your people like Unknown 23:33 wow, and it’s how you respond to them. I mean, God the number of trolls I’ve had over the years we put an awful things on my wall. But now I’m like, thank you. Thank you so much of just giving me a brilliant piece of social media content. Because how I respond to you, you know, thousand people read your comment 3000 people read my reply, you know, it’s that it’s that terrible review that gets left on TripAdvisor. It’s how the hotel owner responds that makes you decide whether you’re going to stay there are not because we all know that people right stupid things and the emotion that is the person owns it is that honest if I handle it with grace and it can actually be more of a sales split sales appointment you think of you know Unknown 24:13 absolutely really shows tree character doesn’t it does definitely So tell me a little bit about like your book you’ve written a book the entrepreneur which is a cool title love that Unknown 24:26 about the book Unknown 24:28 well I guess you know I don’t embrace the phrase that entrepreneur warmly I feel a bit about it because, you know, usually it’s some dude lying on a Porsche counting cash, you know, and I’m quite scruffy as a set of don’t have never had a business plan on quiet and emotional business person. I’m not to be logical, rational thought should I say that. And so I really wanted to write a book that it’s like look, you can earn six figures, seven figures without doing all these things you’re supposed to do without you know, having the workspace with being bad without having a business plan without without any of that stuff. Because I’ve done it here’s how I did it. And it’s got advice in it and tips and little exercises but it’s it’s funny it’s not a proper its proper business book. It’s not it’s business or light, you know, it’s a good rely on people read it, read it in a day journey, because they’re just like, it’s a giggle, it’s fun, but there are useful insights in there as well. And, and also I just wanted to write a book because it’s pretty exciting when they come and get that smell than this. And you know, it’s a tangible I made this thing wickedness but now I’m trying to write my next book Unknown 25:36 which is going to be called be more sharp, introduce my little sharp here Unknown 25:42 and I’m writing the next book is going to be about business bravery, and the fears and stuff we have around business and how to overcome those. So a lot of things we’ve been talking about today, you know, the, the foam over comparison, ISIS, the imposter syndrome, the copycats all that kind of stuff that’s holds us back from being more sharp and just attacking or business getting things done Unknown 26:06 is there any one of those that has been a key thing for you to be able to overcome I think the Unknown 26:12 worrying about competitors not necessarily comparing myself but just more feeling that people are nipping at my heels so you know I make a thing and then a couple of months later someone else makes pretty much essentially the same thing or you know someone does my course and then they launched a very similar course to mine and it you know you know it’s it’s hard I have big community is a copyrighted is for example you know some of the people in my community community there was an engineering communities but every my community they’re launching templates their health resources courses podcasts all similar to mine you know and it’s like it feels a bit know but then I just so really I wasted a lot of time and emotion worrying about that but you know the truth is there is enough to go around and that’s so cliche and also I can’t have everybody Unknown 27:06 and Unknown 27:08 the clients that didn’t want you and you didn’t want them Unknown 27:11 and you know some people just aren’t gonna like my style like my voice right the way I look that’s perfectly fine and and often you know I run a podcast with my friend Belinda and she has exactly the same offer reside zoom memberships causes she’s building up to have exactly pretty much what I have and that could be a bit threatening but some people have the lender on the podcast they don’t like me very much and some people who love me and they’re not so crazy about Belinda but some people like us both and by both are things so and the truth is as well no matter how much I dislike it or feel threatened by it or get upset by it there’s nothing I can do about it I can’t stop I can’t go to the competitive and say stop I can’t so it’s easy just got to get over it so you’re quick right we’ve got over it the better so now I just do not work on no one’s listening no one’s great you know I don’t want to know anyone people sometimes send me stuff and go hey this is like the exact copy of your sales page and they put it on their page and like have at a good on them you know I want a new sales page great you’ve inspired me muscle Unknown 28:14 cells ventures not going to be even better all I’ll just go Unknown 28:17 What’s the chances of both people seeing both sales pages most to share? So that’s my biggest thing, I think. Yeah, but it’s a hard one. Believe it hard 1 Unknown 28:27 billion daily challenge. It is it is most definitely, I think to for very much. So for people starting out. We often fill our social medias with other people to do what we do. And then it gets you that comparison mode all the time think that what you’re putting out is actually the same as what everybody else is putting out. But when you actually really tap into exactly how you do you deliver always something different. And you be able to what you’re saying before, connect with the right people that want to work with you. And you do it in a way that they needed to hear for it to them. Yeah, Unknown 29:03 and that’s the thing. That’s why it’s so important that you bring as much of you into your marketing as possible so that people are making a choice. They’re choosing it because you’re not vanilla, you know, they’ve got 600 vanilla options to choose from. And you are mint chocolate chip and your proudly mint chocolate chip. And if people don’t like mint chocolate, fine going on a vanilla people. But if you try to be all things to all people, and then there is no choice there’s no point of differentiation and they will choose your competitor. You know people are going to choose the person that clicks with them. So you have to give them some things to click on. You know, Unknown 29:34 that’s that’s the point. I think it’s awesome advice. So has been what’s been one of your proudest moments over the 10 years of being an entrepreneur Unknown 29:44 I think Unknown 29:46 I had a moment I don’t if you’ve heard of Robert garish he was flying solo solo printer PVC. And Unknown 29:54 you can read that book. Yes, yes. He’s got a few books. Yeah. Unknown 29:57 And but he wants said to me, you know, imagine you’re on you’re on stage and everyone’s clapping you and you’re being handed a reward. What is it for, you know, instead, it’s a really good way of getting clarity on what you want your business and at the time I think I said it was fun, you know, writing a young adult novel or something, which is something I would love to do that later in life. But then recently I was on stage everyone was clapping I wasn’t being hands you know what I was being handed I think a bag of crisps or something. But it wasn’t my conference, the copywriting conference, it was the end of the day, you know, bringing all the speakers on stage and my team came up and they had a present for me and I was saying thank you. And the whole room stood up and clapped for me and it was like I did this this huge venue patchy people for all these people that I did this and I don’t know anything about events and only what we’re doing but it was a nice outfit on as well. So I felt Unknown 30:50 I felt glamorous It was just that was awesome that was a really proud moment Unknown 30:56 awesome it must make all of those 100 days that you just so sick of talking about SEO copywriting all worthwhile. Unknown 31:04 Yeah, I think that this tiny moments as well. And I’m sure you have them to. So that was a big glamorous moment. But even sometimes someone will just send me a Facebook message saying, you know, I just read your entire book while sitting in the bath water is cold. And, and it made me cry and laugh. And thank you so much for writing it. And that can be a moment where you go boom, you know, Wow, thank you. That’s pretty awesome. You know, so little things like that can be pretty impressive as well. Unknown 31:30 Awesome. And so you mentioned to you got a couple of kids and you’re married. And you’ve got three podcasts of the guy and couple of online courses and like, Oh, my God like this so much that you offer. And how do you juggle all of that? You say Unknown 31:46 what do you have a question, I only have one child and the manchild which is my husband that a dog but still and I started you know it’s there’s no work life balance. People make that up, you know, have good weeks where I’m a brilliant mom and I’m making perfect packed lunches and nutritional dinners. And the house is clean. And then I have other weeks where it’s not you know, I have weeks where I’m really efficient with my business and everything smooth and then others where I’m literally finishing things two minutes people they would do and I do now have a virtual assistant and she does handle a lot of the kind of dates they emails because there’s so many people in so many courses who’s going to be you know, X amount of people to date, you can’t login or he caught so she handles a lot of that and I worked quite hard. You know, I was a project manager and pretty good at organizing with time and I’m very good now doing what’s the most important thing you know, so, you know, today I’ve had so so little time one thing I really need to do and I did that first I Eat That Frog as they say you know I do the horrible thing first and but it’s it’s difficult. A lot of tools I use a sauna slack I track my time with toggle and disciplined I come to my office I don’t get up and go and do washing you know, bring my lunch to my office. I sit in my office you know I make the maximum time and then in the evening I do like some things like social media so I used the day for deep work and I do like work when I’m distracted but it’s it’s a challenge and I don’t want to make it sound like I’m sitting in a hammock and doing nothing. It’s it’s a challenge and now it’s a lot easier than it was a couple years ago when I was still full time copywriting and building all this stuff and have like a six year old five year old it’s pretty miserable and so you know I think a lot of people come to me and go you know we should do everything you do like okay well here’s what it’s going to take you know your eye out for that and they’re like oh yeah no i’m not i’m really not and their days I see people in my groups you know and they’re like oh yeah we’re not putting up today so I’m just going to go watch Netflix I’m like you don’t think I would love to watch Netflix Of course I would love to just stop now going to have a foot massage but I don’t you know i’m i’m disciplined to have a bit of willpower and that’s made the difference for me you know so Unknown 34:04 yeah, you’re anything that you do for yourself that helps keep you sane. Unknown 34:08 Oh yeah. I mean I would often have free time It sounds like I’m working like a beast but you know I don’t start till nine and I finished it’s three and I have my weekends yeah you know I walk my dog recent podcast go swimming I have massages hang out with my mates all the all the normal stuff and you know but I pack a lot into that nine separate You know, when I’m working I’m working you know even though I’m on social major Unknown 34:31 I bet for a reason I know Unknown 34:32 that it’s just like look at pictures of cats and you know things like that I’ve done to get stuff done and but yeah I treat myself very well I do look after myself Unknown 34:42 you know the mission is not necessarily things that you don’t necessarily make the plans and content plans and all of that sort of thing but is there any way that you do plan goals like you ever see mentioned before you do have you did have some yearly goals how do you go about creating targets goals for what you want to create Unknown 34:59 for you know last year I kind of pulled a figure out my bottom and just that pretty cool if I could hit that a wouldn’t know that that’s me setting a goal this year I might be pretty cool if I could do that again. So that’s that’s my financial planning Unknown 35:13 about about two years ago I said wouldn’t be great if I could get like 2000 followers on Instagram that would be brilliant when it and then I did not seeing on Instagram to two years and did lots of other things as soon as I give myself a goal I’ll do anything to avoid it so what I do more is think about how do I want this year to look like what I what I want to do this year and like last year I said it was all about connection and public speaking for me next year I really want to do some overseas stuff so my my word for next year is born born which sounds really where anyone can I’m heading to the to the Netherlands to speak and to New York to speak and Unknown 35:50 I want to want to do a couple more so that’s as far as I go and then a lot of it is I just want to keep on keeping on you know like I don’t need some big huge goal that’s going to become make me miserable when I don’t hit it I just want to be able to get up each day and enjoy coming into my office yeah that’s for me that’s a huge goal to enjoy your job and to make money from it and to make help people and make them happy that’s those are pretty good goals I think and Unknown 36:17 yeah bloody is causing Why do you Unknown 36:23 tell me a little bit about how you dealt into the whole world of creating some passive income How did that come about? Well I Unknown 36:30 started off with being copywriter and I had I had a document I came from agency life and an agency like you know everything’s completed you have copied up templates financial templates and when I left for took a lot of that with me not not kind of stealing you know all agencies have them you collect them over the years so I had this thing called a copy deck which is like what what agency copywriters put all the copy for saying website into everything’s in one document is well formatted and Scott and index that of cover sounds really obvious doesn’t it but I started to find the other copywriters we’re just throwing together stuff Times New Roman font sizes all different and they looked really ugly so it made people focus on the format not the words because they couldn’t understand it so I had this copy that thing and I was talking about it and saying oh this is awesome people that can’t have a copy so I’ll be giving people allowing my template and I was like I could charge charge 10 bucks for this what I charge 10 bucks with so I made a little shot on my side started selling it for 10 bucks and then as I could I could make another one could not blog posts maybe I could do one for press releases and it’s got a sampling there and it just grew from there and and I think I’ve sold about 3000 copies of that copy deck now to copywriters all over the world and and then from there you know as I offer short maybe I could have like a directory of copywriters pictures and stuff never could have a membership group and I could sell them they’re gonna want stuff so I’ll make some courses on stuff and then no one event so I’ll do some local events and then I’ll make a conference and so it just grows like that you know and only really only those templates are purely passive because I made them once and I don’t often have to update them and they just sit there the courses there’s anything but passive you know that maintaining them but really it’s the support so when people buy my course they are buying the course materials but where they’re really buying is me for three months to be in the group to answer their questions is coaching calls this q amp a that takes time not a huge amount of time but it does take time and so it’s not purely passive and the other thing of course is you have to market it all constantly you know people don’t just turn up and what about you start to get them there but there’s potential to earn a lot more obviously because you’re not selling 121 you’re sending one too many and so you know that’s what really shifted in my business and that that year to year thing of earning five times more was just really giving up I don’t do any one on one services anymore now know copywriting SEO and I don’t even do very many consultants are you can’t very few offer like you can buy an hour of me because I honestly like that’s a whole hour about my day. What can I do that our can help 50 people rather than just that one person how to put a price on that. So yeah, it’s just really making sure that every bit of my day hits as many people as possible helps as many people not hit. Unknown 39:22 Do you think that you do differently that makes you successful? Unknown 39:28 I don’t know. Can I stop Unknown 39:29 myself? I don’t know. Unknown 39:31 I’m think I’m quite enthusiastic. I think I have a sense of I think I’m funny. I don’t know if anybody else does. But I think I bring a lot of humor into my business. And I’m consistent. I’m not consistent in terms of, you know, regularity and being organized. But I turn up you know, I really do turn up I don’t cancel things. I don’t know if I say I’m going to do something I will really do it. Which is often why I said I’m going to do stuff on social media. So but I have to follow through. Unknown 39:59 So Unknown 40:00 yeah, I think it’s a cool Welsh and I don’t watch as well to where that’s an Australian word, isn’t it? I don’t know. Make it make a word up. Unknown 40:08 I don’t. Unknown 40:10 I don’t. I don’t mess around. I mean, I get things done. I do things quickly. I don’t. I don’t second guess myself either. say like, you know, I think a lot of people worry so much about how they put themselves forward in business about the post that check it 17 times to typos. Is it right? Ask their friends? Should I post it? Oh my god. By then I posted 60 things. Half of them have offended someone. one’s got a typo. The other one I posted in the wrong place with the wrong graphic on the wrong day. Doesn’t matter. People scroll down. I no one’s looking. No one cares. Just Unknown 40:42 just crack on. Unknown 40:45 What’s the worst that can happen? Unknown 40:47 That’s actually be my much. Yeah, that’s almost like stop thinking about what everyone else thinks. You know, I think so. Things have you and just do it. Yeah, people. Shark There you go. Very sharp. Sharp. Unknown 40:58 Sharp doesn’t wake up in the morning and worry about what people think of it. It just is a shark and just does shark stuff Unknown 41:04 all day? No questions. Unknown 41:06 We should all be Moshe. That’s my Unknown 41:08 mantra. Love it. Great segue. Unknown 41:13 I did it. Sorry. Last couple of questions. Sorry. What’s the one of your biggest failures? And what did you learn from it, Unknown 41:21 and all the things I got very much in depth with it with the tax office by just being stupid. That was one. So I learned not to be stupid. one bit of advice I give everybody in businesses, they should get a decent accountant from date dots. And they should get zero or whatever platform QuickBooks but unlike zero and from data by email event, 50 bucks still plan your money. Money is what will kill your business. So plan. I really am a big fan of profit first as well. So I’m very careful about my money now. And the other things would be the usual stuff, you know, you launch your work. So you sell one place, and you’re like, this is embarrassing. And then you have to cancel it. But all those things, it’s just been like, well, run it again. And then you’ll sell five places. And if you sell five, there’s five people are going to love it. Because it was only five of them. And they’re gonna get loads of you. They’re going to tell their friends and then you’ll sell 10. So and obviously, I’ve had a few phone calls online were posted embarrassing stuff, or offensive stuff, or things that I didn’t think would be offensive. And I think that’s it. I fell on. I felt over on the stage event. That was fun. And Unknown 42:28 yeah, that’s about it. Really, Unknown 42:31 so many Unknown 42:32 so many, but I can’t remember them. So then clearly weren’t that bad. Unknown 42:36 Yeah, I think too, it’s also the way that you think about, about families or about things not working, it’s actually not something that completely stopped doing your tracks, he kind of just keep going Unknown 42:46 you do I mean, I’d say the side is phone is all the things in business that had the most the when relationships or partnerships broke down. So you know, when, for whatever reason, someone that you’re working with, or was a customer or in any way, and it goes south, and it’s not. And it says, whatever reason, you can’t get that back those of you some of the saddest things because he can’t be in business for 10 years without having a few people not like you and me for whatever reason. So those would be my side is the things to do a couple of people I’ve lost along the way. And, but generally, other than that, and it’s, you know, it all kind of works out in the end. So here Unknown 43:24 So you mentioned that you working on your fear of public speaking and you went out and you just gone her weight and disease management course. Is there anything working on for yourself between 19 Unknown 43:35 and I think, I think I really need to get my head back in the game a little bit. I want to I want to optimize everything that I have. And I really, I’m actually going to hire someone, oh my god, I’m going to let me I’m actually gonna hire a company to look at my whole business and and just see what they can do to make it better. Because I don’t track or measure anything. I don’t use you know, I have Google Analytics. But I don’t I don’t look a convert. Like if you asked me what my conversion rate is for x. I have no idea. What’s my ROI for this? I don’t know how much money did I make the other night? And because it’s all going well, so I’m just like, it’s going well, why do I care? But, you know, I think it’d be interesting to get someone else’s perspective, however painful it will be, and they go actually, where you do this is dumb. You should do this. And I need to hear that, like, I need someone else’s opinion. I’m gonna hate every living second of it. Because I lived think I know what I’m doing. But that’s my focus. to really optimize what I have not make anything. You just make what I have work as efficiently as possible. That’s my plan to travel the world speaking at events, Unknown 44:42 world domination, not just world domination. Unknown 44:45 Yeah, just a bit. Well, done. Nice to sprinkle that, you know, and just the continue having fun reading and to enjoying my business, because I can’t think of anything else to do. So I’m stuck. But no one would employ me now. I’m stuck doing this. So I’ve really got to try and keep it enjoyable. That’s fine. Unknown 45:03 Yeah, keep that balance and fly. That’s awesome. So last question. If you had to enter two parter. So what’s the best advice you’ve ever been given in regards to business? And what advice would you give someone who is in business that’s possibly having a hard time and wanting to get to that 10 year successful stage? Unknown 45:24 I think the best advice that you know, Unknown 45:27 would probably be, you can only do what you can do, which I know that sounds really silly. But I think we all put an awful lot of pressure on ourselves to do all the things and to be everywhere, and we look at people who are down again, we don’t know what’s behind the scenes. We don’t know their financial situation. Yeah, they look like they’re doing is amazing stuff. But, you know, that could be miserable. So I think we put too much pressure on ourselves, we can only do what we can do. Usually it’s enough, you know, so that’s pretty tweet. But I think it’s important to take the pressure off yourself because you myself miserable and I mean, you’re miserable, you’re not productive. And then it’s, you’re doing even less than you could, you shouldn’t do and, and I think for someone who’s struggling and I think, you know, you need to really look up why you’re struggling and what you want to achieve. And you need to give yourself time period. Because, look, running your own business isn’t everybody. That’s why everyone isn’t doing it is really hard. It’s you have to be brave, you have to be resourceful. You have to be good at so many different things, you know, beyond what your actual core skill set is. You become an accountant, a marketer a diplomat at speaker it’s it’s really hard and so I think it has to enjoy the process. I don’t know if you’ve read the book The subtle art of not giving a F Unknown 46:41 and and you know, he talks about how you’ve got to enjoy the process not always be thinking about the end results and you know, someone who wins Madison’s enjoys running Unknown 46:51 you know, if you enjoy running, Unknown 46:53 you’re never going to win American. So if you don’t enjoy the boring repetitiveness of opening emails, reconciling your zero posting things on Hootsuite, if you don’t enjoy that, then you’re never going to get the end result. Because that is the process. So I think that would be my advice. Make sure that you really enjoy the process. And you’re not just doing this because you think it’d be cool because a lot of time running your own business is hard and boring. And sometimes it’s great, but a lot of time it’s just pretty hard and board and I think people forget that, you know. Unknown 47:22 Yeah, absolutely. Right. We see that the end result we see the beautiful images on Instagram. You can guess what it’s like it’s actually crock of you know, you know, Unknown 47:30 surely his buddy is this. He said, Oh, yeah, Unknown 47:35 absolutely. Well, I want to thank you so much for your time today. And your insights and your humor and just your realness of His love, how you really don’t care. And it’s more about just being real and honest. I think it’s awesome. So thank you. Thank you. It’s been an honor to be on your podcast and thank you very much for having me. It’s been a pleasure. Thank you so much. Okay, awesome.